Reguero time wasting conundrum

[Yngwie]

Here's question on the rules of the game.

 

Reguero got booked at the start of the shoot-out for time wasting (which he was).

 

What would have happened if he did it again and got sent off?

[Alex MacLeod]

I had the impression he didn't really want to be facing the penalties

[Renegade]

Presumably, another player would've had to go in goals.  I'm sure I read about that happening somewhere once. 

[Yngwie]

I had the impression he didn't really want to be facing the penalties

 

He certainly didn't do well in the shoot-out. Faced 5 and didn't get within 6 feet of any of them. You could have stuck any player (or fan) in goals and they couldn't possibly have been as unsuccessful, even if they just stood still each time.

 

But that's not the question.

[Yngwie]

Presumably, another player would've had to go in goals.  I'm sure I read about that happening somewhere once. 

 

 

I think you are right. No subs are allowed but an outfield player who was still on the pitch at the end of the game is allowed to take the keeper's place. It appears to have happened only once, to the Botwana keeper in a 2003 tournament.

 

"After being cautioned for time wasting before Malawi converted their third spot kick, Marumo reacted to a pat on the shoulder from opposite number Philip Nyasulu by punching him in the face.

Botswana missed their next kick and when Malawi striker Ganizani Malunga drilled his effort past defender-cum-goalkeeper Michael Mogaladi a dramatic comeback by the visiting Flames was complete."

[+Wanderer]

Presumably, another player would've had to go in goals.  I'm sure I read about that happening somewhere once. 

 

Used to love this in 'Shoot'...

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/nov/22/juan-mata-chelsea#_

[WYNESS101]

Esson would have done better i would have thought. He's being great at stopping them in the past

[jaggy]

The Nessie mascot would have done better. Esson will sense a return chance.

[lukemackay]

may i just remind everyone that a penalty shoot out is not a test of a the goalkeeper but rather a test of the penalty taker at the end of the day if the take hits it well or places it tightly into the corner they arnt gonna be saved, hearts pens were all good. mark brown never saved pens but was down as one of our best keepers.

 

its a one off, regueros been fantastic all season dropping him cause hearts took five good penalties is a tad harsh dont you think?

Edited January 27, 2013 by lukemackay

[old caley girl]

may i just remind everyone that a penalty shoot out is not a test of a the goalkeeper but rather a test of the penalty taker at the end of the day if the take hits it well or places it tightly into the corner they arnt gonna be saved, hearts pens were all good. mark brown never saved pens but was down as one of our best keepers.

 

its a one off, regueros been fantastic all season dropping him cause hearts took five good penalties is a tad harsh dont you think?

Agreed Luke but I must admit was a tad disappointed at Toni. However if that was his best well that's fine and as you say he has been fantastic for us since coming into the team.

[Rainbow]

Rene, you're wrong in this case. The only instance a substitution in a penalty shoot-out is allowed is if a goalkeeper gets injured or sent off and his team hasn't used up its 3 substitutions. As we had still one open, Esson could have gone in. There was a precedence in a German Cup quarter-final (IIRC) when a keeper had been booked during the game and got involved in a hassle with another player whose attempt he had saved and both got booked, resulting in the keeper getting sent off as it was his second yellow. The reserve keeper went in and saved another penalty, seeing his team through to the next round.

In the Botswana incident Yngwie mentioned all possible substitutions had already taken place before the end of extra time.

[+DoofersDad]

I agree with Luke that it is a test of the penalty taker and not the keeper.  However some keepers have more of a presence than others and this puts added pressure on the taker as they sense they have a little less margin for error.  Whilst Reguero has done very well since he's come in I agree with the poster who felt he really didn't fancy it.  I think Esson has more presence for a spot kick and is the more likely to stop a penalty.  As we had only used 2 of our subs, I think we maybe missed a trick here by not bringing Esson on a couple of minutes before the final whistle.  Coming back to Luke's point, this would have placed no particular pressure on Esson as you don't expect a keeper to save a penalty.  It would have put pressure on the Hearts players who would know that the reason the substitution was taking place was because Esson was felt to be a better spot stopper.

[dead_ball_specialist]

He made it far too easy for the Hearts penalty takers imo. Didn't seem to be paying any attention the the Hearts players run ups, just picked a direction to lackadaisically fall in at random. Even if Roberts had scored we still would have lost. Hearts could have scored 20 in a row easily Reguero was so soft.

[old caley girl]

Unfortunately I totally agree dead ball specialist! Getting booked seemed to knock the stuffing out of him altogether and the only way we we would have needed a hearts player to sky it also for us to win.

I take no pleasure in thinking this as Toni has been great for us this season.

Edited January 27, 2013 by old caley girl

[tm4tj]

I don't recall the Hearts keeper getting near any of our penalties, especially Roberts one.

[Yngwie]

Ha ha. So when Terry advised Roberts to "put it where the keeper can't get it" he should have perhaps elaborated a bit.

[ilpadrino]

Rene, you're wrong in this case. The only instance a substitution in a penalty shoot-out is allowed is if a goalkeeper gets injured or sent off and his team hasn't used up its 3 substitutions. As we had still one open, Esson could have gone in. There was a precedence in a German Cup quarter-final (IIRC) when a keeper had been booked during the game and got involved in a hassle with another player whose attempt he had saved and both got booked, resulting in the keeper getting sent off as it was his second yellow. The reserve keeper went in and saved another penalty, seeing his team through to the next round.

In the Botswana incident Yngwie mentioned all possible substitutions had already taken place before the end of extra time.

 

The laws state:

 

• A goalkeeper who is injured while kicks are being taken from the penalty mark and is unable to continue as goalkeeper may be replaced 

by a named substitute provided his team has not used the maximum number of substitutes permitted under the competition rules

• With the exception of the foregoing case, only players who are on the field of play at the end of the match, which includes extra time where appropriate, are eligible to take kicks from the penalty mark

 

No mention of the keeper being sent off, only injured, so this wouldn't apply.

 

However:

 

• An eligible player may change places with the goalkeeper at any time when kicks from the penalty mark are being taken

 

so, presumably, anyone else on the field at the end of normal play could go in goal.

[CaleyD]

I missed what he got booked for....was he by any chance going through his wee routine that he does at the start of a game and after half time?

[tm4tj]

What puzzles me is........how the hell does he get booked for time wasting at a penalty shoot-out.  They can't take the penalty until he is ready, he was kicking the mud off his boots prior to taking up his position and that is seen as time wasting.  It's a joke surely.

[Alex MacLeod]

I missed what he got booked for....was he by any chance going through his wee routine that he does at the start of a game and after half time?

I think this was another of the refs many mistakes. Having said that Toni did go through his wee routine of placing his towel and water bottle. He then went to the post and kicked the mud of his boots. He done all this knowing that the penalty taker had placed the ball and was lined up waiting for the refs signal. I wonder if the mistake was made when the coin was tossed though. Would it have been a different outcome if we had elected to kick first?

[Yngwie]

I missed what he got booked for....was he by any chance going through his wee routine that he does at the start of a game and after half time?

I think this was another of the refs many mistakes. Having said that Toni did go through his wee routine of placing his towel and water bottle. He then went to the post and kicked the mud of his boots.

 

And then after that, he stopped to pull each of his his socks up, even though they were up already. I think that was the final straw for the ref.

[+DoofersDad]

The conundrum to me is how come Toni gets a yellow card for cleaning his boots whilst MacDonald is allowed to scream at an opponent without the referee taking any action at all?  Threatening behaviour is surely a foul and as Roberts had a goal scoring opportunity, should MacDonald not have been shown red?  OK, a bit tongue in cheek perhaps but what Toni did is no different to what keepers do all the time and there is a difference between trying to unsettle your opponent indirectly by a bit of gamesmanship and putting your opponent off by behaviour specifically directed at them.

 

 

[PaderbornCaley]

 

I missed what he got booked for....was he by any chance going through his wee routine that he does at the start of a game and after half time?

I think this was another of the refs many mistakes. Having said that Toni did go through his wee routine of placing his towel and water bottle. He then went to the post and kicked the mud of his boots.

 

And then after that, he stopped to pull each of his his socks up, even though they were up already. I think that was the final straw for the ref.

 

He then got his flask out and had a cup of coffee with a biscuit... He didn't offer a biscuit to the referee.  School boy error.

[GMD]

If you look at the Jones penalty, MacDonald was jumping off his line before the kick had been taken....

Tinfoil hats at the ready :P

[KingBeastie]

I think it was big mistake not putting on Esson who has a decent record with penalties.  Although you could argue that he was not as warmed up as Reguero.  Either way we had the option and IMO we should have used it.  But it's done now.

 

Onwards and upwards!