The new manager thread

[AJS]

Foran will be the next manager of the club, regardless of the circumstances. Of that I have little doubt. 

[starchief]

I think Caley Mad in Berks is right, in that the Board went for what they thought was the best man.  My point is, why did they think that?  What made such an outsider leap to the front?

 

I don't think anyone is talking ICT getting a top dollar manager.  I can't see why it is so offensive to want to know what qualities the Board thought Yogi had above all others that applied.  Why wouldn't anyone that is interested in the club want to know the manager's idea for the key to success that got him the job or his long-term plans over seemingly more exciting candidates?

[gingerjaggy]

I don't think Hughes has been that bad even though I haven't actually seen any games live. Celtic, Dundee United and Aberdeen twice we have played quite well but not taken our chances. Celtic were for the taking but we lacked any creativity, Dundee Utd we should have won but missed a few chances and of course a penalty missed. Aberdeen we played really well in a game and a half and had it not been for that first 45 minutes in the home game we could have had 6 points. We beat hearts and we didn't play well against Killie, Partick and St Mirren. But looking from the highlights ( I know not the whole picture) we hit the post against saints, Greenhalgh missed a sitter of a header at Firhill and Billy missed 3 good chances on sat. So yes performances may have dropped since the start of the season but we had at least one chance to win all those games so we could be higher but we aint. I would be more worried if we became a team like under Brewster in his second spell where we were awful. Hughes may not be the best manager but this club has a habit of getting the best out of unproven or managers who haven't got a sparkling track record. It is far to early for people to be judging him just because they dont like him 

[Scotty]

I don't think Renegade's suggestion is beyond the realms of possibility, and I have to admit that the scenario of "keeping the seat warm" for Foran had occurred to me too. However, rather than think this was the reason for the JH appointment, I prefer to view it as the contingency plan if things go pear-shaped. 

 

Having had the chance to have an - albeit brief - conversation with Yogi recently, I can see how he would have impressed the board. His enthusiasm is infectious and regardless of anything else he is well qualified, as is Latapy for that matter. For that reason, another scenario that has equal merit in my mind is that John Hughes has his UEFA Pro License whereas Hartley does not appear to.

 

According to articles I can find online, Hughes has held this license for a little while and was even a coach last year in conferences run by the SFA (LINK). Latapy is also in the final stages of completing his UEFA Pro license (LINK) This license is required for any coach wanting to manage in the top flight of any league for more than 12 weeks and also for any club entering either the Champions or Europa League competitions.

 

Hartley may have started his (not sure) but the only references I can online find show he was in the final stages of completing his UEFA 'A' in the middle of 2013 (LINK) so even if he started it straight after qualifying with the A certificate (unlikely unless timing worked perfectly for him) then he could not be qualified to coach in the SPFL, or in european competition for anything more than 12 weeks until at least Jun 2014 as it is a year long qualification period.  

 

May not be the reason ... but just as valid as any other theories !!!

[Scarlet Pimple]

The Board wanted someone with experience and got a manager who has experience. He is also older and wiser than the youngsters that are now being allowed to get a chance in the first team.

 

What's the average age of the team? Are they all seasoned professionals who might be by now in their careers also rigid and inflexible in their thinking about how the team should play? No!

Our boys need encouragement, to be worked very hard to separate the wheat from the chaffe and to have someone to look up to as a role model who is clean-cut  and dresses well, as any Manager of Caley Thistle should do, speaks enthusiastically in a very positive vein about them, the team's future etc. In short, POSITIVITY on all fronts. and I would follow a guy like that.

 

He also represents the club up front to the public and visitors alike and creates  a good image in this respect, I am sure, in his role as the club's prime representative.  Is the alternative, a person who looks like an scruff, going to impress?

This is a very important quality, chums, because the Manager is the senior extension of the Board of Directors and should reflect their values to the outside world.

Stability, experience and wisdom are offered by J Hughes who actually is often quite eloquent in his speeches and apparently is a good motivator.So....?

 

God was not available at this time for the job so he sent us a candidate with POTENTIAL who generally met the varied criteria which probably reflected the unanimous views and requirements of the Board Members.

 

So IMHO any reasonable fan would be willing to give him the benefit of the doubt --unless you are a member of Naysayers United when apparently  your agenda may be  more suited to negative back- biting and destructive  comments aimed at undermining the new manager's ability to get the best out of the team and with his demise would come a convenient reason to justify your negativity.

 

David Moyes has experience and by Alex Ferguson's reckoning he was the top choice for the position of Manager of Manchester United in a situation where  there were many other excellent managers available to choose from.

Yet he has struggled mightily in his new position and, like John Hughes, will need time in order to be successful. Even Ferguson himself needed 5 years to establish himself  and is recently on record as  condemning the knee-jerk reaction of the current Owners of the teams in the Premier league who fire new Managers at the drop of a hat when immediate glory eludes their grasp.          

 

As for Richie-who says he is to be the next Manager? A lot of water will probably have to run under the bridge before he retires and nothing in life is certain. As Rabbie Burns said..."the best laid schemes of mice and men gang aft agley..". Dead right on that one Rabbie, as I know from my own personal experience. But from bad mistakes big lessons can be learned and that's how we grow in strength and, hopefully, wisdom. 

Richie, as far as we know, does not at his time have any significant Management experience. So why would he be considered to be the  next managerial Messiah, at this stage of his carerer, for our team. He may  turn out to be fantastic as a Manager but right now he is just another very good player.

 

So, IMHO, the best bet for ICT at this time is to back John Hughes to the hilt...totally. 

[caley100]

I don't think Renegade's suggestion is beyond the realms of possibility, and I have to admit that the scenario of "keeping the seat warm" for Foran had occurred to me too. However, rather than think this was the reason for the JH appointment, I prefer to view it as the contingency plan if things go pear-shaped. 

 

Having had the chance to have an - albeit brief - conversation with Yogi recently, I can see how he would have impressed the board. His enthusiasm is infectious and regardless of anything else he is well qualified, as is Latapy for that matter. For that reason, another scenario that has equal merit in my mind is that John Hughes has his UEFA Pro License whereas Hartley does not appear to.

 

According to articles I can find online, Hughes has held this license for a little while and was even a coach last year in conferences run by the SFA (LINK). Latapy is also in the final stages of completing his UEFA Pro license (LINK) This license is required for any coach wanting to manage in the top flight of any league for more than 12 weeks and also for any club entering either the Champions or Europa League competitions.

 

Hartley may have started his (not sure) but the only references I can online find show he was in the final stages of completing his UEFA 'A' in the middle of 2013 (LINK) so even if he started it straight after qualifying with the A certificate (unlikely unless timing worked perfectly for him) then he could not be qualified to coach in the SPFL, or in european competition for anything more than 12 weeks until at least Jun 2014 as it is a year long qualification period.  

 

May not be the reason ... but just as valid as any other theories !!!

Jeez, this is really going to feck with renegades brain! someone send for the big white ambulance from up the hill...

[Ronaldo]

My objective observation on all the posts is that Yogi was the best thing since sliced bread last week when we beat Aberdeen but one week/defeat later it's oh dear time again.

 

One must laugh........ 

[caley100]

Very true Ron... but that's football for ya!

[starchief]

Some are confusing curiosity with negativity.  I hope he does well and wins the title for ICT.  I'm also prepared to reserve judgement until the end of the season.

 

Nevertheless......

 

...he doesn't have the potential of Hartley.  Nor the track record of success of Sturrock or Calderwood. Nor even the history of Robbo.

 

Yes, we can say why they might not have got it but what made Hughes stand out when no-one else could see it?  Hartley has no experience.  Levein might well have been too expensive etc etc.  None of that say 'it's gotta be Yogi'.

 

Comments about his license (especially being a trainer) go towards explaining things.  I struggle to believe a fan saying they don't care why the decision was made.  It certainly interest me.

[clacher_holiday2]

Can somebody link me to these famed posts from last week hailing Hughes as the messiah?

[Huisdean]

I think those posters who are looking for the reasons John Hughes was appointed ahead of Hartley, Levein et al will wait a long time. The Board are never going to divulge the reasons why they chaose Hughes over anyone else and i would not expect them to. If I go for a job and do not get the job, I would expect some feedback on why I did not get the job but not for that to be made public.

There is only one way to judge if Hughes was the right man for the job and that is by his results (and i don't mean the first seven games) over a substantial period of time. Appointing any manager is a gamble, look at Man Utd, and who is to say that Hartley wasn't a bigger gamble than John Hughes.

Renegade did make the point about Hartley possibly wanting to revamp the club, not sure what he meant by that but if he means the board, then I do tend to agree with Renegade. If we are going to move the club forward, then I think the board needs to be much more proactive. I get the impression that the board is certainly split into different camps (no evidence for this, just a gut feeling)and this is leading to inaction by the Board. It would be nice to see what long term strategy the club has, and most people will accept that this is dependant on many things happening but I for one do not know what this strategy is.

[clacher_holiday2]

Sadly I think you're giving them too much credit with talk of a long term strategy.

 

They've done the obvious thing in the short term in securing longer contracts for players but you would expect this no matter who the chairmen or manager were.
 
Sundays game is huge for this club.

[Kingsmills]

Whatever you think of the rather strange managerial appointment, you have to give the board great credit for being proactive and securing the bulk of the first team squad until at least the end of next season.

[Scotty]

Sadly I think you're giving them too much credit with talk of a long term strategy.

 

They've done the obvious thing in the short term in securing longer contracts for players but you would expect this no matter who the chairmen or manager were.

 

Sundays game is huge for this club.

 

For the last 10 years or so under several different chairmen we have offered nothing longer than a 2 year deal to any player which we all know - with Bosman - is effectively no better than a 1 yr deal as the player is free to talk to other clubs barely 4 months into the second season of his deal. Any response was usually along the lines of longer contracts costing too much if we were relegated ....

 

We - the fans - have constantly bitched about that strategy, so seeing the club starting to believe in itself and being confident enough to offer longer deals to those players we want to keep is a fairly significant, and positive step forward IMO.

 

Agree Sunday's game is very important ... reaching the final would also be another step forward for ICT

[starchief]

I'm amazed Yogi still hasn't got to grips with the team.  A succession of reds, Billy struggling to get a goal and poor results doesn't bode well for the future.  I hope he wins the cup for us but if he stays on, then he needs to dismantle the team.  He's not going to get a dominating team that can push forward and score more than we concede with this squad.  It's the team or the manager.

 

So either we lose a number of players and give Yogi a bit of money so he can buy in some big strong players to match bigger-spenders in the league, or we cut our losses, let Yogi go and bring in someone that knows we have to play a counter-attacking intelligent style with the same players we have.  I'm for the latter.

 

I desperately hope we win the cup.  But it seems a one-off to me.  I cannot see us improving under this manager.  I don't expect him to get sacked (we've not got that kind of board)  but I would rather we cut our losses sooner rather than later.  I'd said to give Hughes til the end of the season but that's too long now.  He can't take us forward, other than a one-off cup final.  I fear for next season.

[MuirtownJaggy]

Both management and players take responsibility for wins and losses, but the players take tactical orders from the manager. In two games now we have played 4-4-2 and lost 5-0 in each game. Coincidence, maybe, linked maybe. I'm not sure the Hughes/latapy paring us right for ICT. The players are as skill full and commuted as they ever have been, so what's changed. Obvious really.

[Guest]

Foran will be the next manager of the club, regardless of the circumstances. Of that I have little doubt.

That was your answer to the teams problems when foran was injured ,he was made look very ordinary today again so you need to drop your obsession .

[CaleyAlly]

going a bit far bringing this thread up, i was against yogi as much as the next guy but he has to be given time, if he doesnt do well in that time then so be it, he should be sacked

[TopSix]

This thread will make for interesting one week tonight.

[chinos]

the management team did nothing wrong today, it's the players responsibility to be up for such an important game

[MuirtownJaggy]

The mid week game against Hibs is a chance for both management and players to redeem themselves from that miserable performance.

[starchief]

the management team did nothing wrong today, it's the players responsibility to be up for such an important game

You thought Yogi's tactics worked?

[Kingsmills]

This thread will make for interesting one week tonight.

 

I wouldn't have revived this thread myself just yet but I can understand why it has been done but I don't think winning the League Cup will alter the legitimacy of discussing the manager's position.

 

Anyone can win a one off game and ourselves and Partick Thistle have shown that the Dons have their off days and are far from invincible. I  sincerely hope we return from Glasgow next week with the silverware but that will tell us little about Hughes's managerial capabilities. All he has had to do so far is to 'mastermind' a win over a poor and demoralised Hearts youth team and we came within 20 seconds and a Nick Ross goal of blowing that.

 

The true measure of Hughes as a manager is the league and the Scottish Cup. In the league it looks as though we will hold on to get into the top six but that's from a position of being clear in second place. In the cup we scraped past Stranraer only to be humiliated as soon as we played the first top tier team we had to play.

 

The Jury has to be still out but the omens are not good and it will take a lot more than a single victory on Sunday, however significant a game it may be, in order to alter that.

[Kingsmills]

the management team did nothing wrong today, it's the players responsibility to be up for such an important game

 

That is a truly bizarre post.

[Fanoffooty]

We've conceded 10 goals in the last 2 games !!  not exactly the inspiration needed going into a cup final !

 

Yogi .....