The new manager thread

[Kingsmills]

Apparently, the new manager will not be fully relocating to Inverness until summer. Given he has two school aged children, that seems reasonable.

Edited December 5, 2013 by Kingsmills

[ymip]

 

I sincerely apologise if my comments upset the sensibilities of the happy clappers on here but I was under the impression that this was a forum where supporters were afforded the opportunity to voice their opinions in a democratic manner. Apparently not....

 

59 pages of varied debate and opinion on this topic alone would suggest the forum and its 'democracy' is not the issue. The issue - as always - is a difference of opinion, a difference of opinion that could not happen if your comments were correct.  Sorry, but even after 20 years of existence, slagging off the forum still pushes my buttons on occasion.

 

 

 

Not often a 35 year old gets a 3 year deal in the Scottish game and he's no Ryan Giggs /sorry but I smell a rat !

 

Confused,Who is the 35 year old you are referring to ?

 

 

I believe that would be Richie Foran .... and yes, I could see him doing his badges in that time and being the next ICT manager.

 

Scotty, I wasn't slagging off the forum I was having a go at the folk on here who freak out whenever anything is posted which could in any way construed as critical of the club - they immediately close ranks and start greeting about it. I'm not having a go at the pro-yogi camp's right to voice their approval but they should dry their eyes when others voice their views which are every bit as valid as their's. I've made my position on this appointment abundantly clear and will leave it at that.

[clacher_holiday2]

Apparently, the new manager will not be fully relocating to Inverness until summer. Given he has two school aged children, that seems reasonable.

 

 

lol.

 

the whole thing has been a farce from start to finish

[Kingsmills]

"Scotty, I wasn't slagging off the forum I was having a go at the folk on here who freak out whenever anything is posted which could in any way construed as critical of the club - they immediately close ranks and start greeting about it. I'm not having a go at the pro-yogi camp's right to voice their approval but they should dry their eyes when others voice their views which are every bit as valid as their's. I've made my position on this appointment abundantly clear and will leave it at that."

 

It seems to me that posters fall broadly into three catagories; Firstly; Those who wanted John Hughes the as the new manager and are pleased with the appointment. I get the impression that these posters are in the minority. Secondly; those who emphatically don't want JH as the new manager and continue to express their disappointment. They too seem to be in a minority. Thirdly; those who were disappointed in the appointment and would have preferred another appointee but are now prepared to put their personal doubts and reservations aside now that the new man in place and give him their backing. It seems to me that this third group considerably outnumbers the other two.

 

Nevertheless, all three standpoints are perfectly valid and make for the sort of healthy debate that is the very essence of a football fans website where, the odd troll apart, we all want the same ends but have different views on how to get there.

Edited December 5, 2013 by Kingsmills

[CaleyD]

I disagree.  I think the largest majority of people didn't really have any strong feelings one way or the other in regards to John Hughes (or any other manager) and were happy enough to place faith that Kenny Cameron and the board are the ones best placed to know who would be the best appointment.

 

This forum has over 2600 active members and you can pretty much count on the fingers of both hands the number who were/are vehemently against the appointment.  They are as entitled to their thoughts and opinions as everyone else...but just because they choose to post the same thing over and over does not (should not) mean they are any more significant than the thoughts and opinions of everyone else, even those who have chosen not to post on the subject.

 

Two things of note....

 

1.  Many of the dissenters have only really become active posters again in the last few weeks.

2.  The number of dissenters is not only a minority, it is largely insignificant.

[+bughtmaster]

With all due respect KIngsmills don't you think that the disgruntled brigade on these pages are a lot more vociferous than the happy clappers.

Most times they are not expressing opinion or debating, just, it would seem, expressing themselves like  spoilt children who have had their lollypops pinched. ?

 

Hope you enjoy the match on Saturday !

[Kingsmills]

With all due respect KIngsmills don't you think that the disgruntled brigade on these pages are a lot more vociferous than the happy clappers.

Most times they are not expressing opinion or debating, just, it would seem, expressing themselves like  spoilt children who have had their lollypops pinched. ?

 

Hope you enjoy the match on Saturday !

 

No I don't. I think that those taking the middle ground tend to be the 'silent majority' whereas those strongly against the new manager and the fervent 'happy clappers' are equally vociferous in stating their respective views.

 

Although I do appreciate a little illogicality in that statement given that I seem to be disproving my own theory by being a vocal 'middle grounder'.

[Renegade]

Interesting reading on P&B there by the Falkirk fan "Choirbairn".  Despite Falkirk being regarded as Hughes best job, he takes a lot of what people have said about Hughes (he's a good youth coach, he plays good football etc.) and debunks it.  Some of it does not get me excited about this appointment at all I'm afraid, and hopefully Hughes will have changed his ways for the job he has here.

[Kingsmills]

I disagree.  I think the largest majority of people didn't really have any strong feelings one way or the other in regards to John Hughes (or any other manager) and were happy enough to place faith that Kenny Cameron and the board are the ones best placed to know who would be the best appointment.

 

This forum has over 2600 active members and you can pretty much count on the fingers of both hands the number who were/are vehemently against the appointment.  They are as entitled to their thoughts and opinions as everyone else...but just because they choose to post the same thing over and over does not (should not) mean they are any more significant than the thoughts and opinions of everyone else, even those who have chosen not to post on the subject.

 

Two things of note....

 

1.  Many of the dissenters have only really become active posters again in the last few weeks.

2.  The number of dissenters is not only a minority, it is largely insignificant.

 

The ' Who Do You Want ?' poll would suggest otherwise.

[CaleyD]

I must have missed the part of the question on that poll which asked for strength of feeling in regards to who people wanted.  It's also very dangerous to assume that just because someone gives a preference means they aren't/wouldn't be content with an alternative.

 

I'd suggest "The Hughes Poll" where 77%+ of those who voted for a neutral/positive option is more telling of the wider view of the fans....even allowing for the fact that it will be skewed by people with a perceived grievance in regards his appointment who are far more likely to express a view/opinion on it (fact of life).

[Kingsmills]

I agree that the Hughes Poll represents the situation but disagree with your analysis of it.

 

The majority of posters take one of the middle options and largely represent those initially disappointed but now prepared to give the new  man a chance. There are a minority of others such as yourself at the positive extreme and a similar minority at the negative extreme.

 

Only when you look at the two polls in conjunction do you get the full picture.

 

In any event, what's done is done. JH is the new manager and it is clear that the great majority of us whether we were disappointed in the appointment or not are prepared to get behind him and back him so let's put the managerial debate behind us now and do just that.

[KingBeastie]

I wouldn't place too much emphasise on the poll.  I voted negatively and have not altered how I voted. I don't plan to either, I answered truthfully when the question was asked, my view has since changed, so be it.

 

Polls... pah!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

I think that the bottom line is that Yogi should not be judged on his appointment but on his performance thereafter. If we go on the appointment I would have chosen Hughes well in front of Levein and Shiels and would have been very surprised if we had gone back in time with Pele, Shearer, Robbo or Brewster. Hartley would have been a good choice but we would have had to pay compensation and Hartley is completely new to the managerial game and would have been a real risk. I suppose that at the present time I am a "happy clapper" - cos I am glad that we moved quickly to erase some of the memories of Butcher - but if Hughes starts making tactical boo-boos or makes a faux-pas then there will be nowhere in Jellystone Park that he will be able to hide from my criticism - but all done in the best possible taste of course !!

[CaleyD]

I agree that the Hughes Poll represents the situation but disagree with your analysis of it.

 

The majority of posters take one of the middle options and largely represent those initially disappointed but now prepared to give the new  man a chance. There are a minority of others such as yourself at the positive extreme and a similar minority at the negative extreme.

 

Only when you look at the two polls in conjunction do you get the full picture.

 

In any event, what's done is done. JH is the new manager and it is clear that the great majority of us whether we were disappointed in the appointment or not are prepared to get behind him and back him so let's put the managerial debate behind us now and do just that.

 

So, by your logic, the people in the middle weren't really in the middle...they were mostly people leaning towards the negative but have now come to terms with the Hughes appointment?  You do realise how ridiculous that sounds, right!

 

I was at neither extreme prior to the appointment and would have been happy with quite a few of those who were suggested to have been in the running.

 

Did we get the best available? On the basis that we only offered the job to one person and they accepted, then yeah, I trust that Kenny Cameron and the board appointed the best person available....and that makes me very happy.

[Sir C the 3rd]

I think there is so much moaning because there was only 1 man who we wanted and we didn't get him. Hartley.  Every other name that was mentioned everyone wasn't fully convinced on, someone had a negative for everyone.  We've ended up with John Hughes, lets just get on with it now.  They're not going to get rid of him due to comments on an internet forum.  Lets just hope he can do a good job.

 

Bad news for Yogi is that anything other than 2nd place and at least 1 cup final will be seen by some people as failure.  Good luck and I;m glad I'm not in your shoes!!

[Kingsmills]

I think there is so much moaning because there was only 1 man who we wanted and we didn't get him. Hartley.  Every other name that was mentioned everyone wasn't fully convinced on, someone had a negative for everyone.  We've ended up with John Hughes, lets just get on with it now.  They're not going to get rid of him due to comments on an internet forum.  Lets just hope he can do a good job.

 

Bad news for Yogi is that anything other than 2nd place and at least 1 cup final will be seen by some people as failure.  Good luck and I;m glad I'm not in your shoes!!

 

On the other hand, the good news for Yogi is that maintaining our current league position and at least one cup final will be seen as success.

Edited December 6, 2013 by Kingsmills

[GaliantGrunt]

Is that what we were demanding from Butcher, 2nd place & a cup final !

I must have missed that one.

I think success for Yogi will be to do as good as last season, maybe better.

[+bughtmaster]

IHE is perfectly right in what he says you judge the man on performance not appointment.....that isn't happy clapping just fairness and that is what the disgruntled brigade or lynch mob whatever they want to be called don't seem to understand.

 

Lets get back to TogetherNess and spur the team on to victory........

[Kingsmills]

Warmest congratulations to this thread for becoming the most popular football thread in CTO history both in terms of posts and page view.

 

Probably fitting that a thread concerning the future should overtake one dwelling on the past.

[CaleyD]

I can agree with you on that one

[CaleyThistle]

"Did we get the best available? On the basis that we only offered the job to one person and they accepted, then yeah, I trust that Kenny Cameron and the board appointed the best person available"

What about Maurice Malpas?

[clacher_holiday2]

I think majority have it spot on, give the guy a chance regardless of your views on him.
 
For me, I won't judge him on any tactical mistakes or results, as we've had some shockers even this season (hammering by St Johnstone and complacency v Partick are the two that stand out) and its to be expected from any manager.  If he gets stubborn with a mistake and doesnt correct it then he should be open to the same questioning any manager would.
 
I'll really judge him on how I perceive his man management skills over time, I'll be convinced of his appointment fully if we can now secure other players on longer term deals.  That will be the real measure of the squads faith in him rather than any cliched soundbites in interviews, in time he'll be judged on his own signings aswell but by the time we get to that stage he won't be considered the "new" manager anyway.
 
I won't jump down the happy clappers throats on here at the first bad result and I'll flat out ignore anybody saying 'I told you so' to me after his first win lol

[clacher_holiday2]

I'm really struggling to be reasonable about this, I'm still in disbelief that he was the best candidate we could find.
 
Levein would've been my number one choice way ahead of Hartley, with Shields 3rd and the rest equally unwelcome.
 
If at some stage it turns out Craig Levein or Hartley were realistic options and we just plumped for the cheaper candidate in Hughes, I'll go buy a Real Madrid top and none of you will ever hear from me again

[izzy]

Just a pity a lot of fans are setting the bar so high for Yogi.

Im not aware of being guaranteed anything under Buthcher etc.

We had a great start to the season hence the reason we are where

we are but we have also had a few nightmare results and who was

to blame for them.

I hope our game is on tomorrow so we can get back to business

as usual under Yogi !!

[izzy]

I'm really struggling to be reasonable about this, I'm still in disbelief that he was the best candidate we could find.

 

Levein would've been my number one choice way ahead of Hartley, with Shields 3rd and the rest equally unwelcome.

 

If at some stage it turns out Craig Levein or Hartley were realistic options and we just plumped for the cheaper candidate in Hughes, I'll go buy a Real Madrid top and none of you will ever hear from me again

Do you really mean that !!