Relegation a reality?

[RiG]

PS. I know that this thread, which originally started as a discussion on whether ICT might be sucked into a relegation battle has gone off topic but I would be inclined to let it continue to run on the main board as the issue is of such high profile and of interest to everybody with an interest in scottish football.

I agree. A merge might also make things a bit murky.

Who was the Gretna manager before "Super Ro"? Apparently 2 managers are owed ?100,000 and ?800,000 - ?900,000. The latter I expect to be Alexander who had a "contract for life" according to Brookazade.

[starchief]

There is a thread on the Non ICT forum discussing this very topic incidentally.

Much as I agree that Gretna should never have been promoted in the first place, I can't help but feel it was an amazing experience for the town and their supporters.

What about the fans who supported the team "Pre Mileson" and now face the prospect of their team sinking into oblivion because of one mans desire to play real life Football Manager? They will be left with nothing.

As much as I feel sorry for those owed money, I'm sure Gretna will do an Airdrie and become another different but the same club (not Gretna but Gretna United or some such).  Probably junior level - just like they would have been without Brooks.  I don't think they'll have many bad memories of their time.  It's just their creditors that lose.

[RiG]

Erm, I never mentioned anything about people being owed money/creditors there but I am havingone of those days so I could well have missed it.

I am talking about fans who supported them for many years before Brookazade turned up possibly losing their football club forever. I wouldn't be best pleased if someone bought ICT only to run it into the ground through shocking financial mismanagement in a few years leaving us with nothing.

Announcement due soon apparently...

[RiG]

Gretna will struggle on but might not have a team for Saturday according to the BBC news ticker.

[Kingsmills]

The suggestion is that they will be short of players to field a team at the weekend which, given that they had over 40 registered players, suggests that a very large proportion have decided not to carry on playing for nothing.

The SPL are not usually sympathetic to requests for postponments where a team has a sufficient number of fit players of whatever level of experience. I wonder what their attitude will be to this particular request ?

[starchief]

I'll get my boots!  :alien04:

[RiG]

BBC Updated Story

[Kingsmills]

So what can the SPL do, impose a substantial fine or dock them points ? Neither is a realistic sanction in Grenta's situation.

The only other possible sanction is expulsion from the league.

[MissICT]

Gretna are defiantly been kicked out the league!!

so are two teams coming up??

[Kingsmills]

No, Gretna will be deemed to be the relegated club so next season's SPL will be the eleven continuinmg members plus this season's first division champions assuming they meet the membership criteria which Hamilton may not at present.

[MissICT]

but 11 doesn't divide equally so how will they decided who plays who??

[Kingsmills]

There will be twelve teams; the eleven others from this season and this year's first division champions make twelve.

Eleven teams may have to see out the remainder of the current season which might mean the odd idle saturday especially for those teams in the bottom six.

[FuriousGeorge]

How will the remainder of the pre-split season continue? For example, on 29th March Gretna should play St Mirren. If Gretna disappear, will St Mirren get the 3 points by default?

:024:

[Scotty]

How will the remainder of the pre-split season continue? For example, on 29th March Gretna should play St Mirren. If Gretna disappear, will St Mirren get the 3 points by default? :024:

nope... this has already been answered several times, but here goes again .....  if Gretna fold then all games they have already played will be void and the points will be deducted from whichever team won them (whether that is Gretna or the opposition). Future games wont exist so there will be no points to dish out.

The final league table would reflect 11 teams playing each other 3 times (to the split) + post-split games

Final league table for top six would have them playing 30 +5 = 35 games, bottom five would be 30 + 4 = 34 games

[Grabe]

Just heard that Gretna FC will totally fold as a club Saturday thus under spl rules they will NOT be considered the relegated club hence another team will be relegated. 2 clubs will be promoted and a newcomer will enter the 3rd division.

:029: :029:

[CaleyD]

I won't criticise Gretna for "Living the Dream", because when push comes to shove everyone knew (including their own fans) that it was never going to be sustainable.  Making the best of what you have whilst you have it is not a crime.

Whilst I have a certain sympathy for the staff, they too were surely aware of the situation when they took jobs with the club that some day it would all go back to the way it was before the massive climb through the leagues.  The sudden nature of the collapse will no doubt cause them problems, but many of them will have had their pound of flesh and if they hadn't prepared for the decline in any way shape or form then really, they have nobody to blame but themselves....each and every person who is employed by another lives with the risk that their job could be snatched away from them at any moment.

Who knows what Milesons motives were?  Only him I suspect.  But what does it matter?  We all know that the SPL is a joke of a league in many areas and if nothing else then the Gretna situation has only served to highlight that and show that we are in need of change.  I don't just mean papering over the cracks and introducing more rules and criteria which only serve to make the league even more elitist that it really is, I mean a proper revamp of the entire system from top to bottom and actions which keep the league open to anyone who is good enough on the park without imposing criteria which cripples them financially.

Gretna have made their bed and they must lie in it.  I don't support suggestions that they should be advanced any money by the SPL.  As things stand they can give no guarantee that they can or will fulfil the fixture list and if they are unable to fulfil their fixtures then, IMO, they are not entitled to a penny from the SPL.

Whilst Gretna are without a doubt responsible for their own situation, the blame for any "embarrassment" being suffered by the SPL/SFL/SFA lies firmly at their own feet.  They are the ones who created the system which has resulted in this situation, and not for the first time.  We can all sit and point fingers at the clubs and say "you should have learned from what happened to so and so" etc, but where is their any evidence that the suits who run the game are learning anything or are not only taking steps to prevent it, but putting in place a system which doesn't promote it?

The current system in Scotland promotes bad business practice.  It creates an environment where clubs are almost forced to "go for broke" or settle for lower division mediocrity.

It's about time people gave up on the infantile "I told you so" attitudes, stop the gloating and looked beyond their noses to the bigger issues that exist.  ICT have had more than their fair share of "luck" since we were formed and even leading up to the formation and the wheels could have fallen off for us on many occasions over the last 14 years.  We were forced into building a new stadium which nearly sent us into administration before we barely got off the mark....we were forced in expanding the stadium and shelling out for groundsharing.....a cost which could have done more harm than many realise if we hadn't secured an early return to Inverness.

We've been fairly prudent in comparison to most other teams and still nearly gone bust...and may well have done if it wasn't for a few things going on our favour when they could easily have gone the other way.  For me that is representative of a system that couldn't be any more fecked up if it tried, and that's where we need to be looking to make change.

So long as you have a setup that p!sses people off so much then you'll always have your Milesons and your Romanovs who seem more intent on giving 2 fingers to the suits than concentrating on building sustainable footballing entities.  Get the system sorted out and much of the rest will take care of itself.

[Johnboy]

Just heard that Gretna FC will totally fold as a club Saturday thus under spl rules they will NOT be considered the relegated club hence another team will be relegated. 2 clubs will be promoted and a newcomer will enter the 3rd division.

:029: :029:

Looks like you could be right, Grabe....  :024:

http://sport.scotsman.com/spl?articleid=3858432

[CaleyD]

Just heard that Gretna FC will totally fold as a club Saturday thus under spl rules they will NOT be considered the relegated club hence another team will be relegated. 2 clubs will be promoted and a newcomer will enter the 3rd division.

:029: :029:

Looks like you could be right, Grabe....  :024:

http://sport.scotsman.com/spl?articleid=3858432

That's an old article...and only part of the "rule".

2 rules exist.  One which says that any team failing to fulfil fixtures gets removed from the league and thus reduces the number of relegation places by one.....and another which says the bottom team gets relegated.

I believe that the SPL have confirmed that should Gretna find themselves unable to finish the season then no further relegation will be enforced on anyone else and the top team from Div 1 will come in to make up the 12th team.

[Scotty]

bottom line is that nobody knows what the SPL will/would do ...... and the lack of any comment on their own official website (the SPL's i mean) seems to suggest they havent got a clue !

fo every article saying there will be relegation, you can find another that says no ..... No relegation - daily record

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Oh fer fecks sake - yas are so feckin naieve at times - Brookes has been a narcissistic PD fer years - he knew he was going to kick it and he lived his OWN feckin dream - you can say fair dos - and he took the Gretna support on a fantastic Magical Mystery Tour - but he feckin knew where the "dream" was going to end - and where has he left his fortune ??

The SPL will payroll or scapegoat Gretna till the end of the season as it cannot afford another total humiliation.

[Kingsmills]

I can't see how Gretna can survive until the end of the season. Relegation will not be an issue. The member clubs make the rules, often as they go along, and will not want to see a member club relegated by default.

[FortressICT]

How can you be so sure Kingsmills?  If the SPL haven't come out and confirmed there will or won't be a relegation?

[FortressICT]

Breaking news on sky sports - Gretna's game will go ahead!

[Joonya]

I've got the next 3 weekends off.... I wonder if they'll be willing to sign me. I don't want a wage, i just wanna play football  :021: :021: :021: :021:

Anyone else fancy a match next sunday at Motherwell??? :001:

[MissICT]

who's going to be in the team??

BBC haven't published the teams for Gretna yet!!