Danny Wilson Ineligible?

[Guest]

The only thing that needs to be checked now is the English FA's rules on cross-border suspensions. Danny Wilson was NOT in the squad for Liverpool's league game with Arsenal as previously mentioned  so could have served his suspension then if the FA's rules make provisions for this. If not, he hasn't served it.

[Renegade]

Can't understand if this attitude of "we should just give up".  

 

Had we done that with the 10,000 seater rule in 2004 we might never have gotten into the SPL!

[CaleyD]

Really disappointed that the club have let this drop on what appears to be the basis of single phone call....and the non-information provided.

 

As I understand it, and I did a lot of reading last night (not on twitter), we would not have expected to see the suspension for the Scottish League Cup show on the certificate from the FA when he returned to Scotland as they are only duty bound to show suspensions outstanding from FA regulated leagues and tournaments.  It is the responsibility of the receiving association to ensure a player has no issues outstanding from any previous registration with them.

 

If the SFA/SFL have screwed up, of course they are going to seek a quick and easy way out....and they seem to have achieved that.

[Sean93]

Only chance we have of getting some sort of valid response together is through group like CJT. 

We as a fan base aren't huge and due to this are complaints will fall on death ears hearts fans at hampden greater financial windfall =swept under carpet.

 

I will be making contact with the club as i find it hard to believe we aren't willing to fight this.

Yes we lost and deserved to but this is hush hush job someone's made a error somewhere and we only want valid proof he's served ban.

[ForzaCaley]

NO!!

Had we lost 2,3-0 fair enough but it was such a close game with the player in question playing the whole match plus scoring a penalty. In the summer everyone and their dug was going on about sporting integrity regarding sevco. This situation is just as serious. If the rules have been broken by hearts or sfa there needs to be a replay at least!

*sorry i thought i put DC comment in. Thats what i was saying no too

Edited January 28, 2013 by ForzaCaley

[clacher_holiday2]

What are CJT planning to do about the football clubs apathy to potentially cheated fans?

The longer this waits, the less likely something will be done about it, once Hearts start selling final tickets that'll be game over.

[ICTRoughi]

This needs to be fought to the death. It's clear as day he was supposed to be suspended. I actually wonder if the SFA may have consider this in a more serious matter if Celtic won yesterday.

[KingBeastie]

Maybe we should ask Chuckles Green to take things up with the powers that be, he loves arguing with them.

Although I can't see the SFA wanting to help Mad Vlad.  Maybe they just don't want to p1ss the mad b@st@rd off again!

Edited January 28, 2013 by KingBeastie

[clacher_holiday2]

Its important for people to know that we didnt lose fair and square on Saturday and any effort to have Hearts punished isn't just us sneaking our way back in through the back door on some obscure legal technicality, it doesn't make us bad losers.

If Wilson didn't serve his ban, we were cheated, he scored a pen in the shootout ffs.

[ICTRoughi]

Its important for people to know that we didnt lose fair and square on Saturday and any effort to have Hearts punished isn't just us sneaking our way back in through the back door on some obscure legal technicality, it doesn't make us bad losers. If Wilson didn't serve his ban, we were cheated, he scored a pen in the shootout ffs.

He wasn't a penalty taker. Zaliukas, Ngoo, Novikovas, Touil and Webster took them.

[CaleyD]

I can assure you that CJT give consideration to all matters where the general feeling among our members and the wider fan community is such that discussion/action is needed.  As the board are all volunteers with day jobs then it is impossible for us to give any instant response in regards our intentions on how we are to go about that...but it will happen at the earliest opportunity.

 

In the meantime I have asked for some clarification on the statment from the official website as it's not clear if that is the final word on the matter or if the club do actually intend to look at it further.

[clacher_holiday2]

Its important for people to know that we didnt lose fair and square on Saturday and any effort to have Hearts punished isn't just us sneaking our way back in through the back door on some obscure legal technicality, it doesn't make us bad losers.

If Wilson didn't serve his ban, we were cheated, he scored a pen in the shootout ffs.

He wasn't a penalty taker.

Zaliukas, Ngoo, Novikovas, Touil and Webster took them.

just checked and you're correct

[Scotty]

I might have got this wrong but is it not the case that :

1. Suspensions cross borders with the player
2. Each suspension is tournament specific (eg 1 SPL match, or in this case 1 Scottish League Cup match). As each country has its own tournaments, the FA receiving the player just applies the suspension to the first available game in any tournament.
3. If Wilson served the suspension with  Liverpool, that's the end of it.
4. If he didn't, then Liverpool, not Hearts, were guilty of fielding an ineligible player, and that would be a matter between them and the FA.

 

I think #1 is wrong unless it is a straight red card for violent conduct meaning the player is suspended immediately for the next game in any competition. In that scenario, I believe it may be enforceable worldwide for the next FIFA sanctioned game the player takes part in so basically any game in any organised league (including welfare/amateur).

 

Going by the documentation already shown in this thread, this was not the case as it clearly states he would be suspended for his next fixture in the Scottish League Cup, not the Scottish League, nor the SFA Cup, nor by extension the English League or any cups in England. As far as I can remember (from my days with the Amateur League), that suspension is enforceable on his return even if the player moves away for a decade or more ....

 

Bottom line is that Its an administrative cockup at some level and ultimately, whether deserved or not, the blame on this lies with Hearts as the rules state the club is responsible. It doesnt matter who the actual numbnuts that failed to realise the issue was, and whether they were employed by Hearts or the SFA, and I actually sympathise a little with Hearts here as it sounds like they tried to check things out ... but based on this error, they fielded an ineligble player who may or may not have had a direct bearing on the result. If we had been hammered, then I would say let it slide, the better team won on the day, but with a game that went to ET then penalties, even though he did not take one, its a very tough call and my ICT bias says we need a little bit more than a perfunctory brush-off. 

 

Club may be a little hog-tied on what they can say, in public at least, and I hope they are doing the proverbial duck and looking calm on top but pedalling like **** underneath !!!! but either way please, CJT, get your teeth into this one ! We may not get a replay out of it, and we may not deserve one, but we do at the very least deserve an explanation ......

[SanMiguel]

Seen somewhere that Hearts make £500k by getting to the final. We should do something about this. 

[old caley girl]

Im with Scotty. We lost and maybe nothing will change that but I for one would like an explanatiion of how this happened. Then we can all move on.

[ICTRoughi]

People are saying Wilson served it on the first game of that season. Just crossed my mind, was Wilson part of the 25 man squad?

[Guest]

People are saying Wilson served it on the first game of that season. Just crossed my mind, was Wilson part of the 25 man squad?

Not sure if he was part of the 25 man squad but he was definitely not listed in the starting XI or as a substitute.

[CaleyD]

People are saying Wilson served it on the first game of that season. Just crossed my mind, was Wilson part of the 25 man squad?

Not sure if he was part of the 25 man squad but he was definitely not listed in the starting XI or as a substitute.

 

And as has been pointed out already, he was not listed as suspended.

[ICTRoughi]

People are saying Wilson served it on the first game of that season. Just crossed my mind, was Wilson part of the 25 man squad?

Not sure if he was part of the 25 man squad but he was definitely not listed in the starting XI or as a substitute.

  And as has been pointed out already, he was not listed as suspended.

Is a Journo really gonna remember if he was suspended? Found this also http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1308165/Liverpool-25-man-Premier-League-squad-2010-11.html

[Alex MacLeod]

People are saying Wilson served it on the first game of that season. Just crossed my mind, was Wilson part of the 25 man squad?

What first game of what season? What 25 man squad?

 

Wilson has not served a suspension in the competition he was suspended for. He was sent of in the League Cup final and went south at the end of that season.

[Alex MacLeod]

 

 

People are saying Wilson served it on the first game of that season. Just crossed my mind, was Wilson part of the 25 man squad?

Not sure if he was part of the 25 man squad but he was definitely not listed in the starting XI or as a substitute.

 

 

And as has been pointed out already, he was not listed as suspended.

 

Is a Journo really gonna remember if he was suspended?

Found this also http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1308165/Liverpool-25-man-Premier-League-squad-2010-11.html

The point being made is nothing to do with his time at Liverpool. The point is he was red carded in the final of the 09/10 League Cup and his punishment was suspension in the next game he was available for in that competition.

[Big G]

After being sent off in the final Wilson played a Scottish Cup game against Dundee United and a SPL game against Hearts (he scored) so why would the suspension be held over till the start of the next season. Also as said by many other posters the ban says "1 Scottish League Cup game".

[Scotty]

After being sent off in the final Wilson played a Scottish Cup game against Dundee United and a SPL game against Hearts (he scored) so why would the suspension be held over till the start of the next season. Also as said by many other posters the ban says "1 Scottish League Cup game".

 

Because the suspension was specific to the Scottish League Cup ... The SPL and SFA Cup are not that competition as you yourself point out in the last sentence.

 

That's why i posted my 1 single question above .... WHEN was this ban served ?

 

If it was served in the Scottish Cup or SPL then tell us ... If it was served in England then tell us. In both cases, it doesnt sound like it is possible as it was a ban in a specific competition not a 'next game' ban that crosses competitions (or organisations)

[ICTRoughi]

People are saying Wilson served it on the first game of that season. Just crossed my mind, was Wilson part of the 25 man squad?

What first game of what season? What 25 man squad?   Wilson has not served a suspension in the competition he was suspended for. He was sent of in the League Cup final and went south at the end of that season.

The year that Danny Wilson transferred to Liverpool, people were saying he served the suspension then cause he wasn't included in the squad. The same year the 25 man rule was included in the EPL, Danny Wilson wasn't named in the 25 but as he was under 21 he could play at anytime. With Danny Wilson not being picked for the squad for their game against Arsenal I'm 2010, it makes it easier for them to say he served it. End of the day, the ban was competition specific. We need the FA to speak up about this.

[Big G]

After being sent off in the final Wilson played a Scottish Cup game against Dundee United and a SPL game against Hearts (he scored) so why would the suspension be held over till the start of the next season. Also as said by many other posters the ban says "1 Scottish League Cup game".

 

Because the suspension was specific to the Scottish League Cup

 

I undrestand that. The point I am making is that if the people are saying the suspension may have been in the first game of the following season when he was at Liverpool when he played games in Scotland after the final so the ban was for the Scottish League Cup only