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Should Hughes be SACKED?


Guest Mahonio

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                         THE END

 

This thread will come to a natural end if or when the team on the park begin to entertain and enjoy success again. Should that happen then I doubt anyone will be interested in continuing to post on the thread.

 

In the meantime, I think it is bordering on outrageous that those who don't seem to have reservations about the manager want to censor debate by calling for the thread to be closed.

 

It seems to me that those who have doubts about the manager, while arguing their position, are generally respectful of the views of those who don't. On the other hand, many of those who believe Hughes is doing a good job seem to be intolerant of the opposing view even being voiced and describe reasoned and considered counter argument as vitriol simply on the basis that it does not accord with their own view.

 

There are a range of views among fans but there are no sides or factionalism other than in the minds of those who will brook no opinion other than their own. 

 

If anyone is offended by the mere existence of this thread the simple remedy for them is to ignore it at let the rest of us get on with debating what we each sincerely believe to be in the best interests of our club.

 

 

 

OK ok I'll nibble your bait once more;

 

You do not want a debate, you want to dictate under that pretence................Trouble is it is transparent and obvious.

 

I do not wish to ignore any reasoned threads, there are some really good posters who contribute constructively and who deal with the present and future of ICT. I am interested to

 

read their views and opinions .............. The others...........  I just shake my head and wonder why they have to write from a mixture of hearsay and uninformed opinion or use

 

 secondhand  opinion gleaned from a minority of ignorant posters on other forums. Posters who think it is clever to slate a good honest manager or/and deride anything that they do

 

not agree with or THINK that they know more about the subject be it person or incidence.

 

Some on here just do not want John Hughes as our manager regardless of  what he does or does not do .  These same people are now so committed to sowing seeds of his

 

downfall that they are running scared that he might just yet prove them wrong. Oh yes some even say they do not want him to fail!  Why then, if they want to be proved wrong, do

 

they keep on posting in the same vein time after time?????

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Personally I thought we were back to our usual fast paced, direct style of play tonight rather than the slower, short passing game that was on show in recent fixtures.   Maybe Hughes was trolling us

I'll have you know that Yogi lets me pick the team every week.

Brill is actually well on the way to rivalling or bettering the amount of clean sheets in a season at 20 (a record currently held by Ryan at 23) This doesn't tally with the current hand-wringing about

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I just shake my head and wonder why they have to write from a mixture of hearsay and uninformed opinion or use secondhand  opinion gleaned from a minority of ignorant posters on other forums.

Or, indeed, make up their own mind based on the drop from clear second with games in hand to 5th, playing players out of position and not to the best of their ability.  Something that mirrors Yogi's previous managerial appointments.  Where is your evidence that the likes of Renegade, RiG, Kingsmills or DoofersDad, for instance, can't come to a conclusion based on what they see?  As for me, I've blogged about Yogi's failings (that are already evident so soon) before he even came to ICT.  That is simply an offensive statement.

 

Posters who think it is clever to slate a good honest manager or/and deride anything that they do

Honest, perhaps, but good???  As for deride anything Yogi does, I think you'll find he got supported, even by his critics, for switching from his disastrous total football to fast-paced wing-play at Ross County.

 

These same people are now so committed to sowing seeds of his downfall that they are running scared that he might just yet prove them wrong

John Hughes will succeed or fail off his own back. To think a few posters will change anything grants this forum too much power. Who is running scared? Which poster wants ICT to fail?  Absolutely no-one.

 

Oh yes some even say they do not want him to fail!  Why then, if they want to be proved wrong, do they keep on posting in the same vein time after time????

Because I think he will.  I'd love to be proved wrong but, this time next year, I'm convinced we will be saying 'why did we ever take him on?'  I'm quite happy not to keep saying this but the pro-Hughes camp keep posting, often in a quite nasty manner.  If Brewster came back, I'd want him to succeed too. Doesn't mean that he will.  And there's nothing wrong with pointing that out.

 

If you say you want what is best for the club, why do you keep supporting a poor manager that will drag us down?  Simple.  You don't have the same opinion as me.  The only difference is I don't mind you having an opinion, even though I'm convinced you're wrong.

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Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I can't agree more, the result against County was fantastic but going by Hughes previous statements it was not played in the manner that he likes his teams to play. I want him to succeed and hope he has leant his lesson from the County game but I am not so sure.

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Are there really people who think that because certain people didn't want Hughes and/or have reservations about him, they're secretly desperate for him to fail?!

 

Jesus Christ! 1eye.gif

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I'll repeat myself from earlier in the thread- my fear is that the first time we lose playing wide men and direct, Hughes will point to that as the reason we lost and use it to justify a return to 'total football'.

 

Maybe Yogi is right, myself and other dissenting voices may just need to be educated?

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Are there really people who think that because certain people didn't want Hughes and/or have reservations about him, they're secretly desperate for him to fail?!

 

Jesus Christ! 1eye.gif

I suspect that this thread may die a death on Friday and rise again on Monday.

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Are there really people who think that because certain people didn't want Hughes and/or have reservations about him, they're secretly desperate for him to fail?!

 

Jesus Christ! 1eye.gif

I suspect that this thread may die a death on Friday and rise again on Monday.

 

  Brilliant top marks IHE

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Very surprised nobody has posted this article featuring Gary Warren yet.... http://www.inverness-courier.co.uk/Sport/Football/Warren-bought-in-to-Hughes-Total-Football-10042014.htm

 

If I was being cynical, I'd say it was being overlooked because it didn't fit with certain views...!!!

 

I've seen this type of transformation tried before first hand here in Toronto.  Aaron Winter got a year and a half to try and bring the Ajax model to the club.  He failed miserably as the style of play did not fit the players on the team nor did that style fit well against the league he was managing in.

 

We had the same articles posted in the press about players "buying in" and all.  Didn't change the fact we lost boat-loads of game and decimated the fan base and our credibility in the league.

 

I guess I'm encouraged that Yogi has seemed to shift tactics to match the players he's got atm....but I'm wary of the ability to achieve such lofty goals for this team in this league.

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Yeah Renegade, sad isn't it but that is the impression that is being put across so it is understandable that people are thinking that way.  

 

It might sound to you that people want him to fail, but they don't.  For what it's worth, I like Hughes as a man - he seems a much nicer bloke than Butcher and I'd love to see him be a success.  That's not to say I don't have reservations over some of the things I've seen and it's only right that those are highlighted when they happen.

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Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County.  The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

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Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County.  The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

 

 

The big worry there Caley D is we only really have 2 wingers and if one is out his whole system falls apart as in previous matches, and why play a system if he doesn't have fit players to make it work ?

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I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

 

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

 

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

 

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides).  I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

 

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club.  There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need.  I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

 

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.

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Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County.  The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

 

 

The big worry there Caley D is we only really have 2 wingers and if one is out his whole system falls apart as in previous matches, and why play a system if he doesn't have fit players to make it work ?

 

 

Absolutely...and therein lies the need for change/development of alternative ways of playing.

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Renegade,  I am glad that you want Yogi to succeed and I do believe that most of our support do. What annoys me is the constant criticism of what he has done in the past, picking on every single failure that occurs now and not giving him any credit for attempting to improve our players' style of play. We have very good players but he knows that they can still be improved and genuinely believes he can help them reach an even better standard. ( remember Bruce and the spider story) There will be blunders made I'm sure, as there has been but given the chance this man could and I feel will succeed, given a reasonable amount of time by the Club and patience from the supporters. Certainly the players themselves seem up for it and they want success.

 

It would also be a help to him if the dark glasses came off some of the so called support and they looked at the wider picture now and again. Why do they think that players are being played in the wrong positions when in fact what is happening is that they are being trialled in different positions in order to build the strongest formations throughout the field.

 

 

Gordieict  yes at the moment we have only two real wingers. Is it not prudent, in our circumstances, to wait till the transfer market opens and then supplement that area from a wide choice rather than rush to get someone in now? I know you are not saying do something now but you say it is a worry we have only two fit wing men!  Hopefully they will both stay fit for the remainder of the season. I agree it is a worry because they were a joy to watch against County.

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I think that some have become to cosy because they happen to have some involvement with the club that that they would never criticise the board/management no matter how bad things might get.

 

If that's aimed at me, then you couldn't be further from the truth.

 

I may not be so publicly critical of the club as I once was, but there's reason for that and it has nothing to do with becoming "cosy".

 

There's two main reasons for it.....firstly, having people at the club who are willing to directly listen and take on board the views of the fans....and secondly, in allowing me to do what I do for the club there is the need for an element of trust (from both sides).  I trust that if I raise a matter with the chairman he will give it due consideration and he trusts that I won't abuse the access and information that's made available to me and which allows me to improve communication with fans.

 

I receive no salary and am not an employee of the club.  There is no contractual obligation for me to refrain from being critical of anything...and I am critical when I see need.  I'm pretty sure if you spoke to Kenny Cameron he would attest to the fact that I can be as big a pain in the ass now as I've always been when I get my dander up over something....I just don't see the need/benefit in doing that on a public forum when I can speak to the man direct.

 

I would also add that anyone could phone up and ask for an appointment with the Chairman if they have an issue they wanted to discuss and it would be welcomed....just not this week as he's away for a few days.

 

 

It wasn't just aimed at yourself but more those involved in CJT at the higher level, I have never seen one of them on here once expressing a worry about the way things are going under Yogi, perhaps its a coincidence and they are all happy and have no concerns going forward.

 

I would question your reply about how you don't need to post on here if you are not happy with things yet will have a dig at fans that do have concerns. There is not much point in coming on a forum unless you put your views across.I hope you can understand that why this is as seen as just defending the club because you have relationship when as you explained this is not the case.

 

I do not want this to be seen as a dig at CJT who I think are doing a remarkable job, however they like us are just fans and there is no real point on coming on a forum unless an honest opinion is put across or in my view that opinion losses credibility. 

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Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County.  The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

 

 

The big worry there Caley D is we only really have 2 wingers and if one is out his whole system falls apart as in previous matches, and why play a system if he doesn't have fit players to make it work ?

 

 

Absolutely...and therein lies the need for change/development of alternative ways of playing.

 

 

And that is my worry I am afraid, take away the County game and we have been woeful 

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Renegade,  I am glad that you want Yogi to succeed and I do believe that most of our support do. What annoys me is the constant criticism of what he has done in the past, picking on every single failure that occurs now and not giving him any credit for attempting to improve our players' style of play. We have very good players but he knows that they can still be improved and genuinely believes he can help them reach an even better standard. ( remember Bruce and the spider story) There will be blunders made I'm sure, as there has been but given the chance this man could and I feel will succeed, given a reasonable amount of time by the Club and patience from the supporters. Certainly the players themselves seem up for it and they want success.

 

It would also be a help to him if the dark glasses came off some of the so called support and they looked at the wider picture now and again. Why do they think that players are being played in the wrong positions when in fact what is happening is that they are being trialled in different positions in order to build the strongest formations throughout the field.

 

 

Gordieict  yes at the moment we have only two real wingers. Is it not prudent, in our circumstances, to wait till the transfer market opens and then supplement that area from a wide choice rather than rush to get someone in now? I know you are not saying do something now but you say it is a worry we have only two fit wing men!  Hopefully they will both stay fit for the remainder of the season. I agree it is a worry because they were a joy to watch against County.

 

No I don't suggest that we go and get wingers now, in fact I am not ever sure Yogi will go and get some in the summer as I am not sure that is in his master plan also its not easy to find effective wingers on our budget, particularly now that SM has gone with his talent for finding gems in the lower leagues. My point was he continued to play his system when the wingers were not fit when it was obvious it wasn't working. 

 

I am not saying Yogi can't get it right but I do have doubts and this is not just to do with his previous track record, sometimes managers just click at a club, my doubts come from the matches before County. 

 

Anyway one of us will be proved right and i hope its me thats eating humble pie, I did over Butcher

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Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it. 

 

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

 

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

 

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County.  The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

 

 

The big worry there Caley D is we only really have 2 wingers and if one is out his whole system falls apart as in previous matches, and why play a system if he doesn't have fit players to make it work ?

 

 

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/inverness/256881-its-not-broke-dont-fix-it-says-john-hughes-after-first-win-at-inverness/

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26877820

 

Time will tell.  Im not here to be proved right that hes a trainwreck, I hope youre correct in feeling things are still moving forward in the right direction.

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Interesting to hear Warrens views on 'total football', despite how shocking the results, manner of goals conceded or the online outcry from a typically submissive support was in reaction to it.

CaleyD, the win up at the pikeys came about due to abandoning the tippy tappy sideways stuff up the middle that Hughes just a week ago was keen to promote. "Togetherness" hasnt come from Hughes footballing vision but the footballing vision of the fans and the previous manager, if you want to talk about dismissing information relevant to a discussion for the sake of having a knock, then ignoring how we played to get our last win and how it contradicts the pass-it-in-circles stuff Warren and Yogi love.is doing just that.

Hughes had to drop his own principles to bring us back on track, we aren't there because of them.

I've already had this discussion and am not in agreement that anything was abandoned in our match against Ross County. The only real difference was that we had 2 fit wingers for the first time in a while and that, IMO, better facilitated the balance that Yogi has been striving for.

The big worry there Caley D is we only really have 2 wingers and if one is out his whole system falls apart as in previous matches, and why play a system if he doesn't have fit players to make it work ?

2? What about Ross and Williams ?

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