MrCaleyjag

Matchday Thread - ICT v Arbroath (H)

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Unfortunately the manager seems to only to have one way of playing regardless if its a strong Dundee Utd away or an average part time team at home .The formation and tactics remain exactly the same.

Scraped by today but only just and that was down to a bad error by their keeper.

 

 

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3 points at the end of the day no matter how we got them! See the style of plays getting slated remember the same s£it when yogi had us playing good passing football been spouted a lot of fans wanted route 1 stuff then no point crying now wev got it!

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Another point big shout out to Miles Storey getting the 1st of what will be many goals this season and to think it was a NO from most fans on here eh football authorities that they are!

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4 hours ago, IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER said:

2-1

Oh great seer, can you do the lottery numbers as well next week please :thumbup: 

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Not going to lie, I think Walsh needs to work on his crosses. Most (but not all) were more like passes which, in turn, found nobody. There was a couple that actually caught some airtime, but ground driven crosses aren't very helpful at the range he was putting them in from...

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16 minutes ago, Jack Waddington said:

Not going to lie, I think Walsh needs to work on his crosses. Most (but not all) were more like passes which, in turn, found nobody. There was a couple that actually caught some airtime, but ground driven crosses aren't very helpful at the range he was putting them in from...

Actually the ground driven crosses are probably more effective against physical and defensive teams like Arbroath. Low balls pinging around the box are more likely to cause errors than high balls in, because Arbroath were playing an extremely low block with defenders that are competent in the air.

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2 minutes ago, CameronMurray said:

Actually the ground driven crosses are probably more effective against physical and defensive teams like Arbroath. Low balls pinging around the box are more likely to cause errors than high balls in, because Arbroath were playing an extremely low block with defenders that are competent in the air.

It was more from where he was doing it from than where they were going. From the second half, where it's clearer to see the attacking work, where he was putting in the low crosses from weren't going anywhere. Their defenders were terrific, and are considerably better, it seems, than ours. They can challenge the ball well both in the air and on the ground and can get it out of danger easily. That's exactly what we need from our back 4, we're all over the shop, but Arbroath had it handled to a tee.

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5 minutes ago, Jack Waddington said:

It was more from where he was doing it from than where they were going. From the second half, where it's clearer to see the attacking work, where he was putting in the low crosses from weren't going anywhere. Their defenders were terrific, and are considerably better, it seems, than ours. They can challenge the ball well both in the air and on the ground and can get it out of danger easily. That's exactly what we need from our back 4, we're all over the shop, but Arbroath had it handled to a tee.

Yeah I suppose but then on the flip side Arbroath made it difficult to get into quality crossing positions. Maybe if players had started making runs to the front post, we may have got more chances to score. In regards to the Arbroath defenders as players I don't think they were better than any in the Caley defence. I think it's the more the fact they are so well drilled defensively and know what their doing as a unit. If Caley can get the sort of cohesiveness defensively as last season then things will definetly start looking better.

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Relieved to get the win.  We looked pretty poor and lacking in imagination throughout the team, but having said that, we did create several good chances.  Doran could and probably should have scored at least 3 and White should have done better than direct a free header into the waiting hands of the keeper.

Defensively were looked very shaky again.  We need Welsh back and I also think the current performances are showing what a miss Chalmers is.  We are lacking solidity in front of the back four and that is being exposed when the full backs go forward.  It seems that some players are unsure of their roles at times and nor more so than for the Arbroath goal.  Liinn should not have been in so much space at the edge of the box, but when the ball came to him, nobody went to close him down.  He had so much time to tee up his shot it was like he was taking a free kick.  Storey was fortunate with his goal but he struck it hard and he offered more movement up front than others had shown.  Todorov had no real chance to show his footballing skills but he is clearly capable giving defenders a hard time.  I would love to see him start and be given the opportunity to show what he can do.

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It's clear not just to me but to a lot of folk how much we're missing Welsh, what pains me is that we should not and cannot rely on one player to remedy all our defensive frailties. We have seen already this season how supposedly 'lesser' teams can be effective against us by sticking to a system of play that seems to be really well drilled into them, everyone knows their job and where his team mates should be. Very rarely do I get the impression from us that we are operating as a team, in control if the ball and playing to plan.

I believe we have a decent mix of players, quite a good bunch overall - I just don't think they are being coached into a team yet, perhaps they don't have faith in the system they are being sent out to play,  I don't know, they seem to play individually  - especially at the back.

I think there needs to be an improvement on the training ground as well as some tactical/personnel adjustments asap.

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3 hours ago, Tree said:

Don’t understand why Vincent is being slagged off.

Issues are around long ball to a player who never holds it up and being supported by Keatings who either stands looking at the opposition getting to the ball first or has no end product.

Will save the standard of crossing for another day 

Me neither. My motm 

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Totally agree that Vincent does not deserve the criticism, he put in a great shift. The lack of quality in our crosses must be addressed, no wonder White was disappointed in being taken off not one decent cross to attack

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4 hours ago, hislopsoffsideagain said:

Hope the commentary sounded okay for those who were listening in.

 

Thought the first half was great entertainment. Arbroath had no interest in sitting deep and pushed players forward when they could with Linn the obvious threat on the left. He had a shot over the bar with his left foot and a right footed one saved comfortably by Ridgers early. Meanwhile Keatings kept popping up in the space in front of their centre backs and was the creator of almost everything good for us. Doran got in behind twice, but the first time he struggled to get the ball out of his feet and shot tamely and the second time he took too long and allowed Jamieson to block. Keatings then had an audacious overhead kick which looked terrific from my vantage point but was probably an easier save than it looked.

 

So since we were on top, of course Arbroath went and scored. Ridgers flapped at a cross, the ball fell to Linn and instead of racing out to block his shot our players all tried to form a wall on the goalline. So Linn did the sensible thing and just leathered it. Having seen the footage at half-time I think Ridgers should still have saved it. He got a hand on it but was beaten by the power. Crucially we got level just before half-time. Unsurprisingly it was Keatings who played the killer pass (Polworth-esque!) and this time Doran finished the one-on-one. Half-time probably came at the wrong time for us as we looked like kicking on.

 

After the break we started slowly; whilst Doran had another half chance so did Arbroath with one that somehow got flicked away from goal at the front post. The decision to bring Storey on for White kinda made sense as Arbroath were playing a super-high line but White's linkup play had been decent. And with Arbroath now tiring they dropped so deep that their central midfielders were on top of their centre-backs...and therefore denying Keatings any space to orchestrate in.

 

That said when Storey went wide we didn't look any more threatening. Whilst the visitors were now leggy and sitting deep they defended pretty comfortably...until Storey cut in from the left and had a speculative shot that looked like a comfortable save at the near post, only for it to end up in the far corner via Jamieson's hands. It was an absolute gift. I'd love to hear what Dick Campbell said when that happened!

 

Over the 90, we deserved the three points but anyone expecting a comfortable win will have been disappointed. As mentioned above I thought Keatings was terrific. Walsh had the beating of the full-back all day long and our central defenders were excellent in and out of possession. That was as good as I've seen Rooney defensively too, he was well disciplined and dealt with Linn very well.

 

The obvious problem is in central midfield. Vincent's energy proved crucial in the later stages but Carson looks like he's still getting used to playing at this level. His decision-making wasn't great and he was too hesitant. We miss Welsh's confidence on the ball so much. A midfield duo of Welsh and Tansey (hey, I can dream!) would make us an altogether different proposition.

 

Three points are three points. We only won five home league games last year so it's not to be sneezed at.

I agree with much of that. We should not have conceded. I thought Ridgers should have claimed the ball, but when it broke to Linn we did not close him down at all so we brought it on ourselves. 

We were poor first half, with Walsh being the only real spark but not getting the end ball right. What a relief when Keatings played Doran in and he finished well. 

After a shaky start to the second half when Arbroath had a couple of dangerous balls into the box, we pretty much dominated. We got a real break with Storey’s goal, as their keeper should have saved it. 

A special mention for Rooney. That was probably the best I have seen from him. His energy was great and he was prepared to take people on. 

I have seen the criticism of Carson and Vincent. It is harsh. Both were trying to get the ball down and play it and they had energy. They are similar players and I don’t think either is really a defensive midfielder, though, which is exposing our defence. In the absence of Welsh, maybe try McHattie in that role?

Doran was getting into good positions and could have had a couple more. White was getting frustrated with the service: we can’t doubt his commitment. 

Hopefully Storey is fully fit to start the Dundee game, but his energy helped us although he got lucky with the goal. 

It was a tougher game than we perhaps expected, but we are off and running. 

Whilst I would rather be going to a cup game next weekend, the squad have two weeks now to gel and try things. 

For Dundee, if our injuries remain as now, I’d start with;

Ridgers

Rooney, Donaldson, McCart, Tremarco

Doran, Carson McHattie, Walsh

Todorov, Storey

Time will tell!

Pre match, I was disappointed the players from 1994 who were on the pitch were not named, but a great tribute to Alan Hercher from the disappointingly small crowd of 2298. 

Edited by Robert

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7 minutes ago, Crownboy said:

Totally agree that Vincent does not deserve the criticism, he put in a great shift. The lack of quality in our crosses must be addressed, no wonder White was disappointed in being taken off not one decent cross to attack

Maybe White was disappointed because his first touch was awful, his hold up play was worse and because he forgot to take his lead boots off before the game which meant he couldn't jump and win any headers! 

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5 minutes ago, Robert said:

Pre match, I was disappointed the players from 1994 who were on the pitch were not named, but a great tribute to Alan Hercher from the disappointingly small crowd of 2298. 

The announcer doesn't seem to know who our current players are half the time so I'm not surprised he couldn't name the legends.

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22 minutes ago, Buster said:

The announcer doesn't seem to know who our current players are half the time so I'm not surprised he couldn't name the legends.

Surely someone could have written their names down for them. 

I endured Tannadice last Saturday when Dundee United we’re celebrating the 50th anniversary of their colours and they had players from several generations taking a bow. All were named letting the crowd show their appreciation. 

It happened before the players came out. We could have done the same today.   

I tape the Sportscene results each week. When I watched last week’s, the reporter kept calling Jamie McCart Chris!

Edited by Robert
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White looked like a traffic cone today, he was rubbish. the game completely changed once storey came on and we started to play a lot better playing the ball on the ground and doing some nice passing moves. Also a deserved motm for carson

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Probably my main problem with Vincent is the fact that he's too pedestrian, and he's far too slow in realising the ball at times. This is probably made worse by the fact he's paired with Carson, who is too similar a player to Vincent, and it probably exaggerates his slowness on the ball even more. Probably if you paired him with Welsh he could work better

 

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Carson was easily the best player on the pitch. He reads the game far better than Vincent, puts in plenty of tackles and was the only player who attempted to block the opening goal for Arbroath. At times in the 1st half we were playing 4-2-4 with Vincent posed missing on a number of occasions. Hopefully Welsh and Carson in the middle against Dundee.

Vincent would be better playing as a number 10 - so Keatings or Vincent? No room for both IMO.

Walsh was poor (by his standards) and I was surprised he stayed on ahead of Doran.

Todorov should get a start, Storey made an impact but I was a little disappointed that McGregor didn't get on.

 

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First half was pretty decent in my opinion especially the first 25 minutes that was when we created most of our chances could of scored a few by HT had we been more clinical. Again though we conceded when we looked comfortable. 

We failed to deal with a Thomson cross from the right he found Bobby Linn who got way too much time & space on the ball giving him enough power to smash it past Ridgers. Carson seemed to be the only one who tried to block it.

Jordan White didn't have a good day at the office his head got on the end of about 3 decent crosses but he failed to find the back of the net. There was Good link up play between him & Vincent with the handball incident he just couldn't quite pull it off today. On another day i'm pretty sure he would of scored at least one of those chances. 

Doran got in a good couple of scoring positions but sometimes I thought he was trying to be too clever. He got a brilliant chance to score after a lovely pass from Keatings but took way too much time to decide where he was going to shoot. The Arbroath keeper (Jamieson) managed to come of his line & save from close range he then saved Tom Walsh's rebound which was a pretty good save to be fair.

Keatings nearly scored a great goal with a bycycle kick he just needed a bit more power. It was a brilliant assist from him to Doran for the first goal that through ball was perfect & this time Doran took no time & was composed enough to score. 

The 2nd half was not as good we were very lucky Arbroath didn't score again. I don't know how the hell they missed that chance shortly after the whistle it was a very dangerous cross from McKenna which was begging to be smashed in the net how Spence missed that opportunity is beyond me.

We didn't create as many chances as we did in the 1st half a low cross from Walsh found Doran in a great position but his shot was comfortably saved by Jamieson. 

A Walsh corner then found Mccart his effort was just wide.

It got worse when Storey came on not his fault it was just cause Arbroath decided to play deep due to Storeys pace. We definitely play much better when teams play higher up.

After that we were really struggling & looked like we were lacking ideas. Storey caused some problems & he got lucky with the goal. He did well to cut inside from the left & it was a great shot but Jamieson should of saved it with both hands the power of the shot got the better of him he won't want to see that again anytime soon......

We could of killed the game off after a decent move from the team resulted in Walsh finding Keatings his deflected shot just going wide.

Good save from Mark Ridgers right on the 90th minute Donnelly managed a wee spin in the box & pulled of a shot no one saw coming apart from Ridgers good reflexes & reaction from our number one. 

We couldn't match our 5-2 win against Arbroath 25 years ago it was without a doubt an ugly win just scraping by in the end. Still good to get a win in the first home game of the season but we gotta do better against Dundee. 

 

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Credit to Rooney who looked knackered at the end - great effort after a long time out. White looked thinner in white but still failed to convert a lot of Walsh deliveries to his head in the first half. Carson is a very good new recruit - he has played in a few positions already and looks very promising. Vincent for me is very lively. Pleased to see him back.  I thought Arbroath played extremely well.  They have some very good players and should have retaken the lead immediately after half time. We were lucky not to be in the same hole as we were against Cove.  

Walsh did have a very good game and will probably be happier assisting Todorov but needs Robbo to rest White.  Keatings is another good signing but like most of the team needs more game time before we wake up. However, two games in, and we have hauled ourselves off the bottom.  The Championship is a brutal league to be in. Dundee United look as though they will walk the first place as long as Shankland remains fit.  As for the other 9 teams, it is safe to say there are 3 play off spots up for grabs and we need to target one of them.   Onwards to Dundee in two weeks time and it is time we achieved something there again.  

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Lots of wonderful reports and all chillingly accurate.

What I will endorse is that Walsh, whilst being one of our more effective players, his crosses, especially in the first half were woeful. Why float the ball into the box 20 yards high when our striker can get little purchase on the ball if at all. The ploy after the break seemed to be drill them in low, but into a packed defence that won't work either. It appears that we have lost the art of being able to take on and beat the defender. Well worked goal in the first half after we for once managed to thread a decent ball into the box. Storey's goal caught the keeper out with the sheer brutality of the strike, absolutely hammered it.

ps if anyone want there report added to the published report, let me know

Cheers.

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Hopefully start Storey and Todorov nxt week be a better gauge of where we are 2 against play off rivals I'd drop Carson as well try McGregor a bit more direct of a player! Think well get better as the season goes on specially at the back wev a strong defence they're for some reason bombscares so far! Hopefully Robbo be brace with the tactics wev been woeful 2 watch so far this season

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