Where Have AllThe Fans Gone ?

[Kingsmills]

Last week we had a very disappointing crowd against Hamilton for the first home match of the season especially considering our great start away at Pittodrie.

This week, on a pleasant August afternoon, we can only muster just over 4,000 against Hibs, far and away our lowest ever SPL gate in Inverness against the Hibees.

I know that season ticket sales are well down on previous SPL seasons despite slightly improved marketing but it seems a worrying trend is appearing. Since we moved back to the Longman our average crowds have hovered about the 5,000 mark. This year it could be 5 or 6 hundred less which would equate to a drop in income of around ?200,000 in the course of the season at a time when, Marius apart, our wage bill is the highest in the club's history.

Is the novelty of SPL football in Inverness waning ? is it the recession ? or is it dissatisfaction with poor results and negative, uninspired football even at home ?

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

It will be interesting to see the faces in the traditional away support next weekend. As a "part timer" I have to admit that the pennies being spent are getting more and more and that may also be a reason for the central belters and the journey North. Petrol is more expensive, match entry is more expensive and grub at the grounds and en route is more expensive. I also have to admit that the standard of play - both ours and others last season was woeful at times. The away days simply aint what they used to be.

[Libero]

Last week we had a very disappointing crowd against Hamilton for the first home match of the season especially considering our great start away at Pittodrie.

This week, on a pleasant August afternoon, we can only muster just over 4,000 against Hibs, far and away our lowest ever SPL gate in Inverness against the Hibees.

I know that season ticket sales are well down on previous SPL seasons despite slightly improved marketing but it seems a worrying trend is appearing. Since we moved back to the Longman our average crowds have hovered about the 5,000 mark. This year it could be 5 or 6 hundred less which would equate to a drop in income of around ?200,000 in the course of the season at a time when, Marius apart, our wage bill is the highest in the club's history.

Is the novelty of SPL football in Inverness waning ? is it the recession ? or is it dissatisfaction with poor results and negative, uninspired football even at home ?

i'd go with a combination of the latter two suggestions as been hugely contributing factors

[SMEE]

I think it is the cost, plain and simple!

[givmeaccccc]

It's the cost. I takes me the best part of a day's work on the wages I earn to take my seat in the Main Stand. ?25 plus programme, half time tickets, bus costs, etc amounts to over ?30. It is so serious that I wouldn't mind too much if I had, for economic reasons, have to revert back to Highland League to watch football.

Incidentally I don't have Sky, Setanta or any other TV other tham 'council TV' so I need my fix of weekly soccer.

[Guest Aboynamedsue]

Aye its the cost , especially to away games , its no a cheap day out

your talking about the best part of ?60 or ?70 1 Adult 1 Child

Transport ( supporters bus probably being cheapest option ) & even then they're hounding you for money for " time of first goal & who scored it " "collection for the driver " even though he gets paid for his job !!!!

Ticket prices

Food & drinks

[The Mantis]

I think it is the cost, plain and simple!

I certainly gave the last two Saturdays a miss in order to pay my dues to Barry on Monday, but then I'm coming from 170 miles down the road so my opinions don't really count for much. We're finding that we need pretty much a full car these days to make it worthwhile with the cost of fuel.

The days when I would drive up on my own for the day are well and truly gone. Company on the road, and cost, are big factors.

I feel that if I lived in the Sneck I'd probably make all the home games and not bother travelling much, but I have to say the style of play is pish-poor and has been since Brew returned. Even under CC we at least went down trying to pass the ball.

I had a flash of optimism at Pittodrie where we were absolutely tremendous. We passed it well against Liverpool but that was a game with no pressure. Reading the comments here just reinforces what I already felt.

I hope some of these players can learn quickly, but I fear Barrowman isn't up to the job. Imrie was so good against the Dons I was almost willing to change my mind about him, but it seems that was just a flash in the pan. I've never rated McGuire. We're missing Granty though. Also I've spent a lot of time in the past defending Russeldinho so no apologies from me if I say again we're lost without him.

I hope Brew can keep us up but I fear he's got no clue. We'll see what happens when we visit pointless Falkirk next week. If we can win there it'll be an early pointer as to who's going down. However, given our recent form at their place, I think it's more likely that they'll get off the mark next week with a win.

Edited August 24, 2008 by The Mantis

[CaleyD]

You just have to look at the number of people who prefer going to Away games to see that the "Matchday Experience" at home just isn't appealing to people these days. I had use of a Season Ticket last year and I still had Saturdays where any excuse was welcome to not bother going to a home match, I went to games, but it always felt like a hassle to do so....yet on a few occasions I changed plans and went out of my way so as I could attend Away days.

For this season you can add to that the fact that I'm so p****d off at the way certain things have and continue to be done at the club that I wouldn't give them the steam off my last turd, let alone any cash. It's been like that for me for a few seasons now, but my passion for following ICT always won out over my other feelings....however I don't know if that will be the case this season. I've listened to both home matches on the radio so far and will likely continue doing so until there's vast improvements in the way the club is run and I feel they are actually listening to the fans. I'm not going to be contributing towards the wages of people who treat us (the fans) like something they scraped off their shoe and who view us as a necessary evil.

If that means that my financial contribution to football ends up in the pockets of the opposition, then so be it, I know I'm not the only person who feels this way and I just hope that those with the power to make the necessary changes wake up and take notice that people are now starting to vote with their feet before any real damage is done.

[clacher_holiday2]

Good posts and a good question.

I've said it all before but I'm sick of the way things are done at the club, when I last lived in Inverness I made the decision not to goto dozens of games, preferring to just meet folk in the Inness pre-match then head off to a pub in town to see the scores come in, a wise move on many afternoons.

If I felt like we were going in the right direction I'd probably make more of an effort to get to maybe one game a month (live in Edinburgh) but as things stand theres not a hope in hell.

Incidentally, as a side to us doing nothing to improve the infrastructure of the club since promotion, one of the very first things Hamilton did this summer when being promoted was build a permanent club shop, as 'thats what the fans of an SPL club deserve'. I warned off it loads of times but every teams thats come up behind us has progressed or is progressing beyond where we currently are, we still have plastic stands and a portacabin to call home into our fifth year of top flight football

[Guest birdog]

Incidentally, as a side to us doing nothing to improve the infrastructure of the club since promotion, one of the very first things Hamilton did this summer when being promoted was build a permanent club shop, as 'thats what the fans of an SPL club deserve'. I warned off it loads of times but every teams thats come up behind us has progressed or is progressing beyond where we currently are, we still have plastic stands and a portacabin to call home into our fifth year of top flight football

Whilst understanding the points you are making I believe our facilities at the moment are adequate for the gates we get and that any available money could be better utilised in other ways ie the first team squad.

[+Wanderer]

I warned off it loads of times but every teams thats come up behind us has progressed or is progressing beyond where we currently are, we still have plastic stands and a portacabin to call home into our fifth year of top flight football

So where did we finish against those coming up behind us? A good question.

05/06 +25 points (Falkirk), [currently +4 points]

06/07 +10 points (St Mirren), [currently +3 points]

07/08 +30 points (Gretna), {er, that's enough stats - ed!}

If only we had built a shop.

Mods - can you reinstate the 'Ignore' button on this damn site.

[Guest birdog]

Mods - can you reinstate the 'Ignore' button on this damn site.

Go to member profile and in the "options" drop down menu it is the top choice.

[Council Juice]

I think in terms of off the field development Falkirk and St Mirren and even Hamilton are starting to overtake us.

Id have bought a season ticket in the summer if i wasnt so skint then and now. At the moment i have to make do with picking and choosing games and grabbing mates to watch games in the capital. Going week in week out is simply far too much for me. I might look at seeing if theirs any ticket packages in the new year but the cost of travel and games is way too high for regular attendance.

If i wanted to i could but it would mean not going out at the weekend. And too be honest if i had the choice of travelling 100+ miles up the road and the same down again every week or going out with friends for a drink and having a good time dancing and socialising to the sounds of modern times and time of bygone eras and then playing football the next day with a stinking hangover and a rotten gut with the lads i'd choose the latter.

Some people may not like that approach. Call me a part timer, arm chair fan, non die hard. Probably a correct assumption. And thats fine. Some people spend alot of their hard earned cash watching their team and dont always get much back for it. Too be honest though i'd rather be out with mates than going to games on my lonesome everyweek if i had to choose. And i have to choose. I have muchos muchos respect for the people who watch their team on a cold wet winters wednesday night and coming away after a 0-0 draw. Its not for me though.

In saying all this i will go to more games this season than i have seasons past (in the SPL) and get behind the team.

Edited August 24, 2008 by iamthecaptain1

[clacher_holiday2]

How many points did we finish above Falkirk and St Mirren last year Wanderer? Have we made progress from +25 and +10 points?

[clacher_holiday2]

Falkirk are building a third permanent stand to bring their stadium capacity well above ours, which will return more money long term, the ground also looks 100 times better than ours and doesnt look as if its being built on the cheap. St Mirrens new stadium will open this year and offer them far greater opportunities to make money form the ground all year round and more on match days.

Hamilton are the third team to come up that will invest in their infrastructure, plans have already been submitted for a new stand with increased corporate capacity and of course their club shop now has a permanent home, so the fans dont feel like pikeys when asking to try on a shirt before buying it.

None of that has an effect on the first team, perhaps in the future when 3 or 4% is being added to the clubs annual turnover but not initially, which really isnt the point at all. The stadium should be there to service the fans at all stages on a match day, even something simple like not asking fans to cue in the pissing rain on their way to spend more money would improve the Tullochs (nevermind having to sit in the open end of the main stand to watch a game like Monday nights!).

If you want to ignore everybody on here who isnt totally satisfied with the way things are run at the club, or the apparent lack of motivation to push us forward in any way, then youll be counting about half the members of this site out right away. Though youd be free to post up as many irrelevant stats from 2005 as you wanted without people laughing at you.

[Scotty]

Its all well and good throwing out stats Wanderer - I should know, I do it often enough !!! However, in this thread I have read several comments from fans of various backgrounds and who live in various places and the stories are pretty well consistent

1. The economic climate is a big factor. Thats a no brainer. We have all heard credit crunch, the 'R' word (recession), and all sorts of other forecasts of doom and gloom. Football tends to come from most people's "disposable income" so when that is being disposed of before you get it ... there is a lot less to go around.

2. The club are doing nothing to entice fans. Whether it be personal issues with certain staff, the quality of the product on display (long ball hoof), or just the countless PR blunders we see each year, the club are - and have been - alienating themselves from the normal fans for quite some time. The permanent club shop is not a solution to all of this, but the lack of one is most definitely one of the outward symptoms of the contempt from some, and apathy from others, aimed towards fans.

I hope to be in Inverness for a visit soon, and right now I dont know if I can be bothered even looking at what game is on !!! That may not say much to you, and it is unlikely to have the club quaking in its boots but it is very telling to me personally.

[Kingsmills]

Interesting replies. I missed the Hamilton game, thank god, but have seem some encouraging and entertaining football against Aberdeen, Liverpool's fourth string and, at times during the first half, yesterday against Hibs.

Nevertheless, I share the underlying dissatisfaction with the style of football we are playing especially at home. The TCS has one of the best and widest playing surfaces in the country crying out to be exploited by expansive creative football but Brewster seems intent, even against opposition like Hamilton, in continuing to deploy negative counter attacking tactics.

I suspect that if we were utilising the park like we did in the days of Steve Paterson crowds would be at least 1,000 more on average even at the extortionate prices now being charged. Although cost may remain the biggest factor. I'm relatively comfortably off but still find it difficult to justify to Mrs Kingsmills paying well over ?100 to take my two sons from Aberdeenshire to watch the football when the four of us can go the the cinema, sit in the warm and get some gurantee of entertainment for a fifth of that.

The club have to recognise that, more than ever now, they have to provide value for money or this trend will only accelerate.

Even as things stand, we will need to embark on the sort of Cup run we've not enjoyed for a number of seasons now if the loss of gate revenue is not going to be reflected in a six figure hole in the profit and loss account.

[CaleyD]

The fact is that attendances and season ticket sales appear to have dropped and the club, as far as I can see, are doing very little to find out why, let alone taking action to rectify the situation. So far, the only "solution" seems to be to throw up more advertising boards to try and offset the loss.

Maybe they are doing things "in the background", but when the biggest problem is your public image, then you need to be telling people that your working on things and demonstrating that your taking action. What's the good in doing things to improve a situation when you don't tell people about it?

It's getting to the stage where people have more reason NOT to attend than they do to attend. On their own, each reason might seem small and insignificant, but when you start adding them all together then it's plain for all to see that there's a problem and it's getting worse, not better.

I used to feel that, as fans, we were listened too. The club might not always have taken the action that we wanted, but at least you felt that they had taken your points on board and given them consideration....we don't even have that now.

The club need to learn to start listening and communicating again, or not only will they not have the funds to improve things, but they won't have the funds to even maintain things as they are at present.

[+Wanderer]

How many points did we finish above Falkirk and St Mirren last year Wanderer? Have we made progress from +25 and +10 points? :thumb04:

Seem to remember we finished above Falkirk, I notice you don't mention Gretna...now who's being 'irrelevant'?

Still think a club shop would've guaranteed a top 6 place though.

Edited August 24, 2008 by Wanderer

[Kingsmills]

Despite the fact that we've been an SPL side now for 5 years, the commercial/PR side of the operation seems often to be still hovering mid way between the Highland League and the Third Division.

I had the impression that that side of things were being improved under the Chairmanship of Mr Savage but that his commendable efforts to improve things were being frustrated by those with a different and less positive agenda as demonstrated by the laughable efforts to put some positive spin on the unsavoury nature of his parting from the club.

I nothing is done to improve things then I agree with Caley D that it will not simply be a matter of stagnation but that we will begin to go backwards perhaps even more rapidly than we progressed in the first place.

We'd all hate to see that so hopefully someone with influence at the club will take notice and begin to take the appropriate action before it's too late.

[clacher_holiday2]

How many points did we finish above Falkirk and St Mirren last year Wanderer? Have we made progress from +25 and +10 points?

Seem to remember we finished above Falkirk

Falkirk 38 49 -4

Hearts 38 48 -8

Inverness CT 38 43 -11

St Mirren 38 41 -28

Kilmarnock 38 40 -13

:thumb04:

Of course those promoted clubs havent gained on us whatsoever Wanderer have they?

Or we could just use a side thats now extinct as the yardstick on how far we've come on all aspects of running a club, that way we'd look like Real Madrid and nobody could criticise a thing.

Edited August 24, 2008 by clacher_holiday2

[strathyjags]

i havent had a season ticket for 2 season,s now,and dont really miss it,when i had a season book i never missed a home game,yet away games were a problem,now its a mixture of my wifes work commitments on a sat,my son,s care and lack of intrest that keep s me away,but also the clubs negativity also makes me think twice about going to games.

prices for games like hamilton,st mirren,motherwellfalkirk etc should be ?15 then you would get more bums on seats,ok maybe not enough to justify reducing it by ?5 per person,but most would by food,drink etc in the ground so would make up for it,clubs have been doing this for years but ict dont seem bothered,it always sticks in my mind a few seasons back going to tynecastle and having a seat in a decent stand(a palace compared to ours)for ?10,thats the prices that fill grounds

as has been said numerous times before the club dont listen to fans,i remember having a long phone conversation with morven regarding the car park,yet years on nothing has been done about it,more lost revenue they dont seem to care about

i took 2 young girls upto barrys testimonial with me,1 hadnt been at tcs since the pele days and the other for at least 4 years,neither could believe we had a prtacabin for a club shop,and the amount of away fans i have heard over the years remarking on it is amazing

[CELTIC1CALEY3]

Money is a critical factor for both sides ie club and supporters. However, something that should override the divide is the pride we all have that we have an SPL place. Take it away and it would be all down hill I suspect for a long time.

This year's crisis is potentially different from last year's crisis. As a starter, hopefully the players are better equipped this year to make some money from some cup games to keep the ship afloat. The Marius money may help cut losses if that is what some are predicting.

Hopefully, new packages might be creted for supporters e.g. Season ticket reductions after each game with existing season ticket holders happy to see more than pro rata discounts to generate income.

[Guest WynessLegend]

Plain and simple.

It's the TV.

[+Wanderer]

How many points did we finish above Falkirk and St Mirren last year Wanderer? Have we made progress from +25 and +10 points?

Seem to remember we finished above Falkirk

Falkirk 38 49 -4

Hearts 38 48 -8

Inverness CT 38 43 -11

St Mirren 38 41 -28

Kilmarnock 38 40 -13

:thumb04:

Of course those promoted clubs havent gained on us whatsoever Wanderer have they?

Or we could just use a side thats now extinct as the yardstick on how far we've come on all aspects of running a club, that way we'd look like Real Madrid and nobody could criticise a thing.

Lovely...Kilmarnock were apparently relegated last season. Suggest you give Mr Jeffries a call Clach...and another of your wonder teams, St Mirren, finished below us...1 out of 3 certainly proves your case.

But that Club Shop...dammit, you're right, that would've made the difference!