Is Butcher solely to blame?

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

The board let him?? The board are terrified of him. He runs the ship, so yes he carries the can for mistakes.

Narcississm is all about power and control. He really does totally run the ship but he projects the blame on to crew members and/or anybody suitable and relevant. But you simply can't blame Butcher for everything. Finances are restrained everywhere, attendances are falling across the land, people are voting with their feet due to both economics and the standard of fare being offered. Butcher to me is the "catalyst" in this scenario.

And Doual has always had a point, plus County are on a "high" and they will have a better support, and probaly squad, than us next season. The one point about the wages is that we did appear to be in a position to offer better deals to Tansey and Hayes. They left to further their careers and I suspect that they and others felt stifled by the type of footballing "style" that we were embarking on. It is not all about apathy. It is also about the frustration of the performances and the tactics employed. I fer one am afraid that the ruthless culling of Tokely will make matters a lot, lot worse.

Where the feck are the lauded Muirfield Mills Consortium when you need them ?!!

[+Tree]

Where the feck are the lauded Muirfield Mills Consortium when you need them ?!!

Where are the fans when the club needs them? Reduced attendances, reduced ticket sales, reduced income from commercial!

The reality is that this is happening to all clubs. The team which finished third and are in europe have a £200k reduction in their wage budget ('punishment' for failing to sell a player for reasonable return)!

The reality is that the investment has more to do with dealing with last season's losses than this coming season's incoming players.

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

I would have thought that the question mark and the two exclamation marks at the end of the sentence would have heralded a suspicion that a tad of sarcasm had been utilised. But perhaps answer one question with a mere yes or no. Is it a distinct possibility that the the reduced attendances and season ticket sales could also be linked with the standard of football served up last season ?

[gordieict]

I would have thought that the question mark and the two exclamation marks at the end of the sentence would have heralded a suspicion that a tad of sarcasm had been utilised. But perhaps answer one question with a mere yes or no. Is it a distinct possibility that the the reduced attendances and season ticket sales could also be linked with the standard of football served up last season ?

I have no doubt the standard of football has not helped attendances, after all I am sure we all know folk who has said "I am not going back to watch that p1sh" last season. Footballs an entertainment business, how many times did ICT entertain last season?

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Well there is probably only one answer to that - at Rugby Park, Kilmarnock - when we threw away our "system" and went to an attacking 4-3-3 and/or 4-3-1-2.

[gordieict]

Well there is probably only one answer to that - at Rugby Park, Kilmarnock - when we threw away our "system" and went to an attacking 4-3-3 and/or 4-3-1-2.

Sorry I meant to say at home, so that narrows it down even further. Times are hard and football is competing for people's smaller amount of disposable income, Butchers tactics while not the only reason are a major contributing factor to our falling attendances.

[+Tree]

I would have thought that the question mark and the two exclamation marks at the end of the sentence would have heralded a suspicion that a tad of sarcasm had been utilised. But perhaps answer one question with a mere yes or no. Is it a distinct possibility that the the reduced attendances and season ticket sales could also be linked with the standard of football served up last season ?

The element of sarcasm was not lost and indeed my comments were not solely directed at your post but more towards the wider relationship between the club's ability to invest and the income streams which are all diminishing.

[gordieict]

No not soley to blame but his treatment of established players, dreadful tactics and blaming everybody else apart from himself makes him more guilty of our current problems than anyone else. I hope I am wrong and he turns things around as I think we are stuck with him, after all I can't see anyone else wanting him

Edited June 4, 2012 by gordieict

[Alex MacLeod]

Going to be a bit contravesial here but NO Butcher is not to blame. The blame lies at the low fanbase. The lack of funds. The state of Scottish football. And the state of britian as a whole. Running a successfull football team needs money. The sugar daddies are few and far between. The fanbase is falling. The sponsors are tightening their belts and the whole country is fekked up. Add it all together and we, the humble citizens, cant afford our recreational hobbies.

[Oddquine]

Good points oddquine whether we like it or not ICT definitely don't have the fanbase there are more football fans in the city that support other teams rather than their local team

Now I have my opinions on why that is but I'll not go into it again knowing I will be verbally attacked but here are two links backing up my initial point

http://www.invernessreds.co.uk/

http://www.spanglefi...tsupportersclub

Along with all the old firm fans/buses that leave Inverness every Saturday that is a lot of any fans in anyone's book

It's highly likely that Ross County will have a higher average attendance than us next season and yet Dingwalls population is less than 6000!!!!!!

The apathy of the Invernessian football supporter

Dougal

It's not just from Inverness, Dougal. I don't much see the buses from Inverness heading down to the Central Belt, but I'd be surprised if there were less than head down from Caithness and pass my bus on the road to Inverness on match days....or the ones I know head to Glasgow etc from Moray and ignore the existence of Elgin City.

Don't understand it myself, unless it is a case of not really being a football fan at all, but just wanting to be someone who can say they support one of the two biggest teams in Scotland, have a drunken day out and, if lucky....or unlucky..... a good fight into the bargain.

[absent friend]

He really does totally run the ship

So 'TB totally runs the ship'

As this is the case I think his bar staff are requiring his input, too few when the pressure is on and don't get me started on his pie making skills.

His inability to sell the corporate boxes should be addressed .. what is he doing with his time?.

The car park is crap on match days - time he addressed this, it is not as if he is giving his team any advice.

His handling of the grass cutters leave a lot to be desired, the stand side cutting is iffy!

His ICT site members concerns need addressed - what right has he to ignore them and more so, our well informed contributors on this site talk so much sense, Terry.

The players needs and tactics for next year are already in good hands if he just listens to the well qualified, reasoned, presentations on this site - easy peasy - we don't need a football manager at all. That wonderful player Munro, the one ALL the SPL clubs were fighting over when we released him, should be reinstated in the heart of our defence along side Rossco and their speed and ball distribution will bring instant success.

Oh, should there remain a wee bit of concern re the tactics etc... it would appear from the above posts.. you should just watch the Tinks. ....they are so much better than us.

Now the financial situation... I think Terry that you should set up as a NEWCO ... Inverness Thistle FC (2013) and get rid of all the moaning minnies on here at a stroke!

Reclaim the high ground Terry, you know it makes sense, we did come from up the Hill, look once again down on the nerds as we always did and allow them to find their true home, over the bridge with their distant relatives.

Oh, and yes you are at fault - the toilet cistern is also iffy and it is your fault!

[lukemackay]

He really does totally run the ship

So 'TB totally runs the ship'

As this is the case I think his bar staff are requiring his input, too few when the pressure is on and don't get me started on his pie making skills.

His inability to sell the corporate boxes should be addressed .. what is he doing with his time?.

The car park is crap on match days - time he addressed this, it is not as if he is giving his team any advice.

His handling of the grass cutters leave a lot to be desired, the stand side cutting is iffy!

His ICT site members concerns need addressed - what right has he to ignore them and more so, our well informed contributors on this site talk so much sense, Terry.

The players needs and tactics for next year are already in good hands if he just listens to the well qualified, reasoned, presentations on this site - easy peasy - we don't need a football manager at all. That wonderful player Munro, the one ALL the SPL clubs were fighting over when we released him, should be reinstated in the heart of our defence along side Rossco and their speed and ball distribution will bring instant success.

Oh, should there remain a wee bit of concern re the tactics etc... it would appear from the above posts.. you should just watch the Tinks. ....they are so much better than us.

Now the financial situation... I think Terry that you should set up as a NEWCO ... Inverness Thistle FC (2013) and get rid of all the moaning minnies on here at a stroke!

Reclaim the high ground Terry, you know it makes sense, we did come from up the Hill, look once again down on the nerds as we always did and allow them to find their true home, over the bridge with their distant relatives.

Oh, and yes you are at fault - the toilet cistern is also iffy and it is your fault!

Superb.

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

I am heartened that I am bringing out the sarcasm potential of some previously staid posters. I have to accept your reasoning behind the whole ship analogy but the captain of a ship is dependent on his crew and your post relates mostly to the responsibilities of the Stewards Department. And perhaps Terry is a "fool from the hill" and it is the merger to blame !!

[Georgeios]

Here's another thought... We have fans on here tha look at other teams fan sites, answer me this, do those forums slag the **** out of their own players? I was thinking about the comments we've made on here n let's be honest they'd read some I'm sure, makes you wonder why no one wants to stay really ;-)

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

I am shure that players are receptive to constructive criticism.

[Georgeios]

LoL

[+DoofersDad]

Good points oddquine whether we like it or not ICT definitely don't have the fanbase there are more football fans in the city that support other teams rather than their local team

Now I have my opinions on why that is but I'll not go into it again knowing I will be verbally attacked but here are two links backing up my initial point

http://www.invernessreds.co.uk/

http://www.spanglefi...tsupportersclub

Along with all the old firm fans/buses that leave Inverness every Saturday that is a lot of any fans in anyone's book

It's highly likely that Ross County will have a higher average attendance than us next season and yet Dingwalls population is less than 6000!!!!!!

The apathy of the Invernessian football supporter

Dougal

It's not just from Inverness, Dougal. I don't much see the buses from Inverness heading down to the Central Belt, but I'd be surprised if there were less than head down from Caithness and pass my bus on the road to Inverness on match days....or the ones I know head to Glasgow etc from Moray and ignore the existence of Elgin City.

Don't understand it myself, unless it is a case of not really being a football fan at all, but just wanting to be someone who can say they support one of the two biggest teams in Scotland, have a drunken day out and, if lucky....or unlucky..... a good fight into the bargain.

And how do the fans of Wick Academy view your jaunts over the Ord to watch one of the two biggest teams in the Highlands?

I would like more folk living locally to watch ICT rather than other teams, but let's just respect their freedom of choice.

[+bughtmaster]

I am shure that players are receptive to constructive criticism.

They probably would be, trouble is a lot of the postings are bordering on the destructive! reading them can not be conducive to the desired effect.

[Georgeios]

Remember too, the are mostly young loons

[Oddquine]

Good points oddquine whether we like it or not ICT definitely don't have the fanbase there are more football fans in the city that support other teams rather than their local team

Now I have my opinions on why that is but I'll not go into it again knowing I will be verbally attacked but here are two links backing up my initial point

http://www.invernessreds.co.uk/

http://www.spanglefi...tsupportersclub

Along with all the old firm fans/buses that leave Inverness every Saturday that is a lot of any fans in anyone's book

It's highly likely that Ross County will have a higher average attendance than us next season and yet Dingwalls population is less than 6000!!!!!!

The apathy of the Invernessian football supporter

Dougal

It's not just from Inverness, Dougal. I don't much see the buses from Inverness heading down to the Central Belt, but I'd be surprised if there were less than head down from Caithness and pass my bus on the road to Inverness on match days....or the ones I know head to Glasgow etc from Moray and ignore the existence of Elgin City.

Don't understand it myself, unless it is a case of not really being a football fan at all, but just wanting to be someone who can say they support one of the two biggest teams in Scotland, have a drunken day out and, if lucky....or unlucky..... a good fight into the bargain.

And how do the fans of Wick Academy view your jaunts over the Ord to watch one of the two biggest teams in the Highlands?

I would like more folk living locally to watch ICT rather than other teams, but let's just respect their freedom of choice.

I don't jaunt over the Ord to watch any teams in the Highlands, I jaunt over the Ord to catch an onward bus to visit my family in my home area which isn't Inverness. I don't always jaunt on home match days......and I don't always jaunt in time to catch a game, and get to where I am going in the time frame when I am expected, which is why I have only managed a couple of Under-19 Games at the stadium, every game played in Wick, and the Cup game in Forres.

I have a large dog who needs to be sat on ...and don't want to take advantage of my dog-sitters so I can attend football matches every second week. I prefer to make sure I can have fairly regular weeks down the road visiting my family, plus the ability to call on my dog-sitters at short notice in real family emergencies than bugger up their lives accommodating my hobbies....so I make do mostly with this place.

Any other snide remarks?

[+DoofersDad]

Oh dear! And we were getting on so well just a few weeks ago. :love02:

[Oddquine]

Oh dear! And we were getting on so well just a few weeks ago. :love02:

Lol! Well, you asked for it!

I do agree re freedom of choice, but if a parent is dressing their new offspring in a baby celtic or rangers outfit before he/she is old enough to focus on their parent's face, that is indoctrination, not choice......imo.

[Alex MacLeod]

Must be a fekkin big dog if you can sit on it quiney.

[CaleyD]

I am shure that players are receptive to constructive criticism.

They probably would be, trouble is a lot of the postings are bordering on the destructive! reading them can not be conducive to the desired effect.

....and a few have crossed the line into destructive and gone beyond that....and not just in regards to the players. Some people on here seem more intent on character assassination than they do in following/supporting the team.

[Huisdean]

I agree with Caley D. By all means respond to these forums and share your opinion but some of the opinions raised on here really make me question whether some posters are actually supporters or just like stirring the s***. Scottish football is at a critcal level, in terms of fimances just now including ICT so, if you can, support the team financially by attending games, renewing your eason ticket and supporting the team amd management next season.