Surely it couldn't happen?

[Ally in the I]

Gretna divorce could impact on SPL table

Gretna's future as a going concern was a matter for debate last night. Their management team of Davie Irons and Derek Collins jumped ship yesterday - the day after it became apparent that the club had been unable to pay the wages of their 60-strong staff - to take charge of Morton, a club which faces the threat of relegation to the Second Division.

 

In their absence, director of football Mick Wadsworth has taken temporary charge of first-team affairs but the 57-year-old revealed yesterday that he hopes to take up a senior post with the Canadian football authorities.

The ability of Gretna to continue to function is dependent on the funding from benefactor Brooks Mileson, whose health problems have triggered the current crisis.

No member club has ever gone into liquidation during the 10 seasons of the SPL's existence but, should Gretna suffer that fate, their results from this season could be expunged, according to SPL sources last night.

"If a club has not fulfilled its obligation to the league, then it will be a matter for the SPL board to decide what course of action to take," said an SPL insider. "Obviously, this is a situation which has not arisen before and we don't want to make matters worse by pre-judging anything."

The ruling body are considering every eventuality for the Borders club but if they fail to fulfil their fixture against Rangers at Ibrox on Sunday -or any of their 13 remaining matches - then their previous meetings with the remaining member clubs will almost certainly be ruled null and void.

Dundee United, who have lost twice to Gretna this season, would benefit more than anyone since Motherwell, their chief rivals for a Uefa Cup spot, would lose the nine points gleaned from three victories against Gretna, leaving them eight points adrift of Craig Levein's team as opposed to one ahead.

[Yngwie]

If Gretna can't complete the season then it would be correct to erase all their results and restate the league table unfortunately.

I'd imagine that if administration occurs they could still field a team for the next 3 months, even if it largely comprises youth players. The real risk is whether they'd be able to pay Motherwell, stewards and police etc, to enable matches to go ahead.

[Kingsmills]

The thought had certainly occurred to me. That scenario wouldn't do us any favours as far as either points or goal difference is concerned given that we've thumped them twice.

There must be a genuine dount about whether Gretna will see out the remainder of the season.

[Kingsmills]

Another unfortunate consequence, if their results are expunged, is that we will, for records purposes at least, fall back below 1000 competitive goals unless we can bang in a few over the next few games.

[Scotty]

A fairer (and easier) way - and one I have seen done in other sports - is to go by the rounds of competition.

they played each team once in the first 11 games - those results should stand.

they played each team once in the second set of 11 games - those results should stand.

if they finish the 3rd set of 11 games - those results should stand too, if not just these ones are erased.

a bit self preservationist I know, but administratively, it makes sense.

[Kingsmills]

Unfortunately, I think that existing SPL rules state that all their results will simply be disregarded.  Then again, ICT have successfully managed to pursuade the SPL to change their rules in the past.

[alimci]

I think Motherwell will be considerably more p*ssed off than us...

[Guest Spectre]

They haven't played St Mirren yet in the second set of games and as far as I can tell (BBC website) it's not even scheduled yet.

[PullMyFinger]

Still one game outstanding from their second round against St Mirren so only one round could stand under that argument. Cant see the SPL going down that road though. Also I've got a sneaky feeling that the rent at Fir Park wouldn't be a problem. :023:

[Guest kingkojak]

i wonder if motherwell would ever consider the possibility of bailing gretna out in a bid for self preservation? 

the extra money from finishing higher in the spl and added bonus of a uefa cup spot would be too tempting a carrot for them to consider losing.

i doubt gretna will be allowed to go to the wall until the end of the season.

[Kingsmills]

Motherwell might not press the matter of outstanding rent but would the players continue to play until the end of the season if they're not receiving any income ?

[PullMyFinger]

From the SPL handbook (page 103)

Club ceasing to play and be a member of the league

H5 If any club in the League ceases to operate or to be a member of the League for any reason, its playing record in the League may be expunged and the number of relegation places from the League shall reduce accordingly.

The man that signs the players pay cheques is in hospital and I would speculate that he is unable to sign. Unless there is some kind of contingency plan at Gretna which I doubt as Irons has gone, I'd expect the players to walk too and see the above rule being implemented.

Tangerine Dream

[CaleyD]

I believe Gretna have more youngsters on their books than any other SPL club (including the OF), so I'd imagine that they would be able to put out a team of some form....not ideal, but certainly a possibility.

I also understand that all contracts/credit agreements are underwritten by Mileson so even if the worst should happen the likes of Motherwell, Stewarding companies etc would still be able to claim against his estate should they choose to continue providing services.

[Guest Spectre]

Most contracts or agreements would cease on a person's death, so you could claim for services up to that point but afterwards it would be down to the beneficiary to decide.

[Kingsmills]

That's true but to take an absolutely brutal commercial approach, Caley D is right all these contracts are likely to be personally underwritten or guranteed by Mr Mileson so any creditors will be able to claim against him or his estate for any debts accruing up to the date of his death but if he doesn't regain capacity they may have to wait long enough for payment out of his estate.

What happens threafter depends on whether he has made any provision for ongoing payment of the club's obligations on the basis of a trust but since he hasn't apparently even made provision for the signing of cheques if he's too ill to do so then that's perhaps unlikely.

[Heilandee]

Would love to see the scenario IF,(big if eh know) Gretna manage to get a draw on Saturday at Ibrox,Celtic catch up and go one point ahead then Gretna's demise comes about and Rangers win the league on the strength of that.........

[Kingsmills]

That would indeed be an interesting scenario.

[PullMyFinger]

Would love to see the scenario IF,(big if eh know) Gretna manage to get a draw on Saturday at Ibrox,Celtic catch up and go one point ahead then Gretna's demise comes about and Rangers win the league on the strength of that.........

An interesting scenario indeed,...............if it didn't affect so many peoples lives......and their families. How would you have felt if the Marrs had managed to put Dundee further into the red and you were sliding down the toilet?

On the plus side of course Dundee Utd would benefit and you'd probably be able to see some European Football next season, I expect you'd like that.

[img width=500 height=333]

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/c/c6/FATHER_TED_Down_with_this_sort_of_thing.jpg

[Heilandee]

Think you misinterpreted my post 4th stand,I dont wish for Gretna to go down the pan,however, if it occurs I'd be interested to see how the decision making process was effected if the title or OF were affected to any degree.

[PullMyFinger]

Think you misinterpreted my post 4th stand,I dont wish for Gretna to go down the pan,however, if it occurs I'd be interested to see how the decision making process was effected if the title or OF were affected to any degree.

You really support the Terrors don't you?  :016:

[Heilandee]

Not as long as meh erse points downwards  :moon2:

[Scotty]

Not as long as meh erse points downwards  :moon2:

Heilandee assures us he is telling the truth ......

[attach=1]

[PullMyFinger]

[Heilandee]

chunts  :015:

[Scotty]

They haven't played St Mirren yet in the second set of games and as far as I can tell (BBC website) it's not even scheduled yet.

Tuesday 11th March @ 7:45pm ..... but I think its immaterial now .... its pretty clear from both the rules and from mutterings within the game that if the worst were to happen all results would be declared void.