Andrew Greig

[caleyrule]

Plenty people seem to be speaking about him so was more a point to say he scored in today's 2-2 draw with Dunfermline in the first U19 league match of the season (other scorer was matty murphy)

Really seems to be having a great start to the season, one for the future perhaps?

[12th Man]

I hope so.

We can have loads of come and go players that on paper you would think could do a good job but without the togetherness and unity of the squad it counts for little, thats why a small team from the Highlands put John Barnes out of a job, on paper he had a bunch of players that should have beaten most teams in the SPL but his team were beaten by a unified team who looked out for each other,who took ownership and responsibility for what they did and always won as a team.

A lot of our youngsters have that unity so it would be good to see that continue into the first team.

[Renegade]

He is highly rated by the Renegade.

[youthcomesfirst]

Andrew Greig or Chubbs as he is known is a lightning fast winger in the style of Johnny Hayes. He has huge potential but, like so many player who can get past a full back at pace he needs to work on his delivery. Will def play pro football tho. The under 19s have a lot of players who have been at the club since they were 8 or 9 and that is were you build the unity that was mentioned earlier. Some player have had poor seasons but Charlie and the coaches stuck with them and they have grown together. I know the coaches at Celtic and Rangers have been amazed that we have managed to keep our young players together for so long and they believe it will make us a stronger club because of it in the long term. The biggest problem we have is the gap between under 19s and the first team. Most of our under 19s are 16 or 17 and although they are exceptional they are way off the first team and need reserve team experience to bridge the gap. Unfortunately the clubs cant afford to run a reserve league but if the SFA and SPL could fund it in some way then that for me would help players grow and develop and improve the standard of the SPL.

[Alex MacLeod]

I think it can be easilly seen that we have a very good youth development system in place. Guys like Shinnie, Ross, Morrison and Sutherland are testiment to that. like you say though, unless the asses in power get their acts together and realise that there is a gap, bring back reserve league, bring back U-21 league, then football in Scotland is in freefall. We are already being compared to the standards of the Faroes. Even the League of Ireland have overtaken us in quality.

Many teams need to bring players through but many of those players with skill get fed up with the lack of competition and match time that they lose interest in the game. One day the powers that be will remove the blinkers and rose tinted specs and see the real world for what it is.

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

There was a great debate on Talk Sport yesterday about the demise of Scottish football and Andy Gray came up with the great point that there is some high standard Academy football coaching but the youngsters find that their paths to the first team can be blocked by average foreigners, journeymen, loan signings and experienced but jaded old pros.

From an ICT perspective - especially this season - why havent we looked at spending most of our dough on an acknowledged centre forward - and saved money by regularly playing - or on the bench - the likes of Greig, Morrison,Shinnie, Ross and Sutherland.

These boys should be the nucleus of our team - they are born and bred to have the desire to play for ICT - I feel that we have not had that feel of "togetherness" since the First Division wonder run. That may be what we miss through the loss of McBain, Golly, Duncan, Munro etc. - camaraderie, togethrness and an inner desire to wear and die fer the shirt.

No disrespect to some of the players currently ensconsed in our starting X1 but how many are here to get experience and put themselves in the shop window with a view of going to a higher level.

I would rather play one of the youngsters than a six month loanee or any of the categories raised by Andy Gray. And as Alex said - bring back the Under 21 league and boundary the number of non scots that can play in it.

[Council Juice]

It is time that the SFA sought to resolve the problem that is the gap between under 19 and first team football. The clubs have stated that due to the costs involved they cannot run these teams. There must be ways of resolving this.

League sponsorship whereby the league takes upon corperate sponsors by which the money is split between member clubs equally to help soley with running costs.

Team sponsorship. Fans and local businesses can sponsor the u21 teams.

Government grass roots funding

SFA funding.

Teams at the moment seem to find that the way ahead is via raising their own prospects and signing released players at no cost. But how can a club stick an 18 year old straight into the first team with nothing to bridge the gap unless they are of exceptional quality? More often than not they cant. Surely if raising ones owns prospects is the cheapest method then finding the money to invest in such would be wiser than spending elsewhere. The cancellation of the reserve/u21 league was very short sighted. Yes it cut running costs at the time but now clubs are actually having to raise their own players more than ever in the last 15-20 years they dont have anywhere to nurture the ones who can go on to 1st team football.

If they were to set it back up they'd have to ensure only players raised through youth systems or of elligible age could play. They couldnt fill it full of players who dont get a 1st team game as they are not 1st pick just for match fitness (arrange bounce games for that.)

The league season could be alot shorter than the 1st team league. Play each other twice or divide it up regionally to reduce travelling distance. (say Inverness, Aberdeen, St Johnstone, Dunfermline, Dundee Utd and erm name from a hat please, Hibs or Hearts) Which ever are the overall shortest differences for teams to travel. Perhaps teams far away from each other could play each other on a neutral venue "somewhere in the middle".

But someone has to take grasp of the situation to allow players to develop into the 1st team unless a significant loan system can be set in place.

[alternative maryhill]

There was a great debate on Talk Sport yesterday about the demise of Scottish football and Andy Gray came up with the great point that there is some high standard Academy football coaching but the youngsters find that their paths to the first team can be blocked by average foreigners, journeymen, loan signings and experienced but jaded old pros.

From an ICT perspective - especially this season - why havent we looked at spending most of our dough on an acknowledged centre forward - and saved money by regularly playing - or on the bench - the likes of Greig, Morrison,Shinnie, Ross and Sutherland.

These boys should be the nucleus of our team - they are born and bred to have the desire to play for ICT - I feel that we have not had that feel of "togetherness" since the First Division wonder run. That may be what we miss through the loss of McBain, Golly, Duncan, Munro etc. - camaraderie, togethrness and an inner desire to wear and die fer the shirt.

No disrespect to some of the players currently ensconsed in our starting X1 but how many are here to get experience and put themselves in the shop window with a view of going to a higher level.

I would rather play one of the youngsters than a six month loanee or any of the categories raised by Andy Gray. And as Alex said - bring back the Under 21 league and boundary the number of non scots that can play in it.

Excellent post.

Another potential drawback about the team relying increasingly on senior players who may only be here for a season or two - and I appreciate that this is simply the norm for many teams nowadays - is that it probably makes it more difficult for young players to come through, as there are fewer old heads with significant experience of playing for the ICT first team to help them make the step up, and less stability in general.

[Scarlet Pimple]

Exactly IHE...Exactly.

[Tug]

while i appreciate where you are coming from IHE i have to say i think the club are in the proverbial catch 22 and trying to do the best they can

we want to see younger players come on and play well score goals etc etc yet the club need to get results and it is a huge gamble.. look how many people were (rightly or wrongly) predicting doom gllom and relegation after wednesday night. i think that as a club ict are probably doing as good a job if not better than any in the league at having a perfect balance in this respect i would love to see mr greig come through but think maybe waiting till even january probably wont hurt him and could prevent a potential horror show which could permanently damage his confidence

[Alex MacLeod]

There was a great debate on Talk Sport yesterday about the demise of Scottish football and Andy Gray came up with the great point that there is some high standard Academy football coaching but the youngsters find that their paths to the first team can be blocked by average foreigners, journeymen, loan signings and experienced but jaded old pros.

From an ICT perspective - especially this season - why havent we looked at spending most of our dough on an acknowledged centre forward - and saved money by regularly playing - or on the bench - the likes of Greig, Morrison,Shinnie, Ross and Sutherland.

These boys should be the nucleus of our team - they are born and bred to have the desire to play for ICT - I feel that we have not had that feel of "togetherness" since the First Division wonder run. That may be what we miss through the loss of McBain, Golly, Duncan, Munro etc. - camaraderie, togethrness and an inner desire to wear and die fer the shirt.

No disrespect to some of the players currently ensconsed in our starting X1 but how many are here to get experience and put themselves in the shop window with a view of going to a higher level.

I would rather play one of the youngsters than a six month loanee or any of the categories raised by Andy Gray. And as Alex said - bring back the Under 21 league and boundary the number of non scots that can play in it.

I'm sure every one of those mentioned bar Grieg, when they've been fit, have been on all the team lists.

Edited August 27, 2011 by Alex MacLeod

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

I wasnt specifically calling for Greig to start as soon as possible but to be a regular on the bench - and most of the others mentioned could be given starts - lets face it Shinnie is playing becos Gillet is crocked - Morrison is playing becos of injuries - Ross has been in and out of the starting X1 and Sutherland hasnt been given a chance.

I really do feel that we had some panic buys / loans this season and the Aldred debacle sums it up for me. The Golbart deal I can understand as we were desperate for a central defender.

Perhaps fate has played a part in dealing these youngsters the opportunity to prove themselves - it will be very interesting to see what happens when we get a full squad gathered - if we ever feckin do !!

[starchief]

As the debate seems to have been expanded by Andy Gray's comments:

I'm not so sure there is the case of not developing youngsters. Look at some of our best prospects: Bannan, Cowie, McArthur, Goodwillie, Fletcher etc etc. All of them and many more (Nicholson, Snodgrass, Hart, McLean etc etc) took the low road to Englandshire for a few extra bob, rather than stay in Scotland where they could have helped Aberdeen, the Old Firm or the Edinburgh clubs to become a better footballing team.

I'm not saying I necessarily blame these players (depends how much extra money) but is there much point developing that talent when the likes of McGuire would rather warm the bench at relegation strugglers Derby, rather than play football at one of the SPL's leading clubs?

Getting back to ICT, surely we can only have a nucleus of Highland/Scottish players if we offer long-term deals? They may not be accepted but it seems to be ICT's stated position that we're only going to offer short term contracts. How about at least offering Ross, Shinnie and Morrison 3 to 5 year deals now, complete with relegation clauses? Perhaps they won't accept but worth chancing our arm surely. It's how Jim MacLean made a success of the second team in Dundee.

[Libero]

May get his chance sooner rather than later if our wide midfielders continue to get injured

[Council Juice]

May get his chance sooner rather than later if our wide midfielders continue to get injured

Was just about to say that with Hayes and Doran out and the likes of Ross and A.Shinnie required in the middle, and G.Shinnie at left back (he could play left midfield) there is a chance he might get thrown in there. Foran took a knock against Killie too but hopefully it's not too serious. With these injuries though, the likes of Sutherland and Greig might find themselves on the flanks for our next game should injuries not relent.

[Libero]

its quite worrying to think that we dont really have any natural wide players fit at the moment in the first team

Foran, Sutherland, Ross and Piermayr can all play wide but its not the ideal situation

Maybe with Doran now injured and Tansey coming back then Tel will go with Morrison and Tansey in the middle with any two from Ross, Foran, Sutherlan, Piermayr in the wide positions.

The other alternative is to put Piermayr in at left back and push G Shinnie into the left midfield position. After his performance on Saturday i think this would be a productive move

What ever team terry decides to play i think there may well be chances for the likes of Greig to make a substitue appearance at least

[Yngwie]

The current injury crisis gets young players like Greig closer to the first team for a short while BUT reduces their chances of getting match experience by going out on loan.

Normally we'd have sent a player or two to the likes of Elgin by this stage of the season.

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Where the feck is Blobby Mann when ya need him - he could play wide on both flanks - at the same time.

[Alex MacLeod]

Where the feck is Blobby Mann when ya need him - he could play wide on both flanks - at the same time.

Pele's assistant at Formartine

[Council Juice]

Scored what was described as a superb free kick at the weekend according to one daily tabloid did our Bloabby.