Admin by Oct 16th - It's here now!

[CaleyCiuin]

16 minutes ago, Yngwie said:

I know we shouldn’t be at all surprised by the severity of our financial plight and the urgency of the situation, but I kinda hoped that Savage was our saviour, especially after all the good things he did in his first couple of weeks. Not criticising him at all, he’s done what he said he would do, ie carry out a thorough business review and keep us afloat financially during that process.

Perhaps admin was his plan all along. Buy it cheap without the debt, then run it as he sees fit with his board / people. 

[+old caley girl]

8 minutes ago, CaleyCiuin said:

Perhaps admin was his plan all along. Buy it cheap without the debt, then run it as he sees fit with his board / people. 

I don't agree 

[CaleyCiuin]

12 minutes ago, old caley girl said:

I don't agree 

He is a business man first and foremost. He would have known some of the big issues from his previous association with the club and his association with two of the current directors. Perhaps the issues he now finds are bigger than he first thought, but it was widely reported before he took his consultancy role that he wouldn’t take the entire thing on with all of someone else debt.

[+old caley girl]

5 minutes ago, CaleyCiuin said:

He is a business man first and foremost. He would have known some of the big issues from his previous association with the club and his association with two of the current directors. Perhaps the issues he now finds are bigger than he first thought, but it was widely reported before he took his consultancy role that he wouldn’t take the entire thing on with all of someone else debt.

I think that may have been mentioned in past but I don't think that's his aim now? The worry with admin is the administrator could decide liquidation best option with no chance of saving club? 

[Starscape]

I'd be happy to give money to restart the club after the restructuring, points deduction etc. Not so sure if it's to pay off debts that the Board bear a lot of responsibility for.

Can we set up something so the administrators see there's a bank of money waiting to be invested but not wasted?

[Robert]

That opportunity already exists with the Stronger Together initiative that the Supporters Trust launched earlier in the year. Funds are held by the Trust with a view to buying shares in the club.  

[STFU]

25 minutes ago, CaleyCiuin said:

He is a business man first and foremost. He would have known some of the big issues from his previous association with the club and his association with two of the current directors. Perhaps the issues he now finds are bigger than he first thought, but it was widely reported before he took his consultancy role that he wouldn’t take the entire thing on with all of someone else debt.

 

19 minutes ago, old caley girl said:

I think that may have been mentioned in past but I don't think that's his aim now? The worry with admin is the administrator could decide liquidation best option with no chance of saving club? 

I think you both might be right.

What we have seen playing out recently is Savage get a foot in the door thanks to the massive incompetence of the board previous chairman and CEO. He has tried to use this situation to persuade/force those owed money to write it off and walk away for the good of the club and to cough up even more cash on the way out so that he can run things until such time as financial contracts and commitments can be run down to a more manageable level.

Given that the board appear to have been clueless even if he did have someone feeding him information before taking up his consultant position he would have had no idea just how bad the ongoing financial commitments were.

Having been unable to convince all those owed money to write it off and walk away whilst also funding things further until it gets to the point where contracts and financial commitments can be run down to a manageable level he has resorted to the previous rumoured plan of administration and taking full control via that route.

One thing that has not been made clear is whether or not the £350k provided by Savage is a true donation to the cause or if it is loans or share purchase.

[big cherly]

In the P&B tonight on FTCTTS. ‘Pictures tell a thousand w…….’
Thought it caught the gravity of the situation we’re in and portrays it better than I could ever. 

Edited October 2 by big cherly

[ScottMacScott]

It's absolutely tatties. Crowdfunding for 200k for an immediate reprieve but needing over £1m to see us thru the season...

Even typing that shows how futile it is. 

Like others I'm willing to put cash into a solvent club, at whatever level, and one run by a board of supporters.

But it's futile now and I'd rather wait until my money is being invested into a future rather than buying a paracetamol to try and cure an incurable disease. 

I'm being naive I know but I remember the hope of the 94 days (even as a Kingsmills man), the crowds and the community.  What I'd give for the club to reinvent itself as that.  

 

 

 

[Scotty]

3 hours ago, CaleyHedgehog said:

Are you committed to paying it, Scotty. Not sure if you have any options, but if so, I for one trust you to make the best decision you can with the information that you have. 

We have committed in email to sponsoring two players, and the money is sitting in my PayPal from all the transactions we collected in here. I want to pay it as every penny helps, but if we were a mind not to, then we could probably say no because we could not be sure the players we have sponsored, or the club, would continue after administration or an insolvency event. I am putting faith in Alan Savage to try and continue to work magic and thats the only thing making me lean towards paying it. Panos and his cronies certainly do not instill one iota of confidence I am sorry to say. 

[Scotty]

3 hours ago, Yngwie said:

I know we shouldn’t be at all surprised by the severity of our financial plight and the urgency of the situation, but I kinda hoped that Savage was our saviour, especially after all the good things he did in his first couple of weeks. Not criticising him at all, he’s done what he said he would do, ie carry out a thorough business review and keep us afloat financially during that process.

I think some of the earlier posts capture my own thoughts too. I agree with @STFU on the hope to come in and run things down to a more manageable level. Cutting our cloth to suit in other words. I also think he knew how much he was prepared to fund himself, but for sure is not prepared to finance golden handshake deals or paying off a former CEO. 

 

3 hours ago, old caley girl said:

I wonder if you need to discuss with Scott Young Scotty? At very least I'd advise holding on till after Mondays meeting 

Yes, not going to pay anything until the picture becomes a little clearer. Would not be prudent. If things went south quickly and we didn't put the money in for one reason or another, then the people who donated it would need to have some say as to where we go from here ... refund or perhaps redirect to youth setup or women's team are just my initial thoughts. As of now however, its ring-fenced and targeted to be paid to ICT. 

 

[CaleyTennis85]

Anyone that thinks administration would be a "reset" is talking complete bull****, I said it before and I'll say it again. It would be DISASTROUS for the club so why Mr Savage is even contemplating it is baffling especially when he was seen as the saviour .

I really hope that some serious investment is found before 16 October because I have had enough of this sh**show now, I really hope Messrs Morrison and Gardiner are proud of themselves for ruining this club .

 

[Scotty]

12 minutes ago, CaleyTennis85 said:

It would be DISASTROUS for the club so why Mr Savage is even contemplating it is baffling especially when he was seen as the saviour .

Because the alternative is liquidation and that's even more disastrous. 

[CaleyTennis85]

23 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Because the alternative is liquidation and that's even more disastrous. 

Ah okay, yes we certainly want a club to support! I just don't want -15pts which puts us bottom because League 2 is just unthinkable and tbh if we went there, I would seriously consider giving up on the club, it's bad enough in this league with this manager but it's a lot better than League 2 or even the Highland League!

As I said, I really hope that something is done to save us, be it an investor or even Mr Savage himself (I would have him as chairman permanently anyway rather than just in the interim)!

[CaleyCiuin]

8 hours ago, Scotty said:

We have committed in email to sponsoring two players, and the money is sitting in my PayPal from all the transactions we collected in here. I want to pay it as every penny helps, but if we were a mind not to, then we could probably say no because we could not be sure the players we have sponsored, or the club, would continue after administration or an insolvency event. I am putting faith in Alan Savage to try and continue to work magic and thats the only thing making me lean towards paying it. Panos and his cronies certainly do not instill one iota of confidence I am sorry to say. 

Perhaps wait until after the 16th of October and see how things are after that. Seems any money the club raises in the next two weeks is for wages etc, including that of the over rated over paid manager!!!! 

[ictchris]

Reading that statement, the club is f*cked.  First point is a crowdfunder to raise £200,000 to keep us going for a couple of weeks, second is "email Panos with money making ideas".  Appalling.

The people they are asking for money have already put in thousands of pounds to the club over the years - they are season ticket holders, shareholders, people who buy merchandise etc.  You can't just keep going back to that well, especially as the club has been so poorly run.

When we got relegated I wondered if we'd make it through the summer, now I'm pretty sure we won't make it through the season.

[Doofer]

What I find totally baffling is the go fund me page isn't even available! If the club is in such dire financial struggles then you would think that this crowd funding site would have been up and running when the statement was release but unsurprisingly it's nowhere to be seen.  

[ClickbaitProponent]

Looking at all that has happened I have one question: Who benefits when the club fails? If you want to find the root cause then that is the first place to look. I think I know the answer to that but they have expensive lawyers and I don't.

RIP ICT

Edited October 3 by ClickbaitProponent

[Charles Bannerman]

2 hours ago, ictchris said:

Reading that statement, the club is f*cked.  First point is a crowdfunder to raise £200,000 to keep us going for a couple of weeks, second is "email Panos with money making ideas".  Appalling.

The people they are asking for money have already put in thousands of pounds to the club over the years - they are season ticket holders, shareholders, people who buy merchandise etc.  You can't just keep going back to that well, especially as the club has been so poorly run.

When we got relegated I wondered if we'd make it through the summer, now I'm pretty sure we won't make it through the season.

I see at least two obstacles to this £200K being raised - people’s understandable reluctance to put their money into something that may well go to the wall, and the poor public perception the club has as a result of things like the Concert Company and a fair bit more.

Then, if it’s not raised and the club does indeed go into administration, there’s always a tendency for people to look at the most recent issue as the decisive factor. Hence the “blame” might tend to be focused on Joe Public’s “lack of generosity” towards the crowdfunding project rather than chronic mismanagement and lack of supervision and control that goes back for years.

One other thought. Doesn’t it now seem absolutely absurd that several vital weeks over the summer should have been wasted on the delusional chancer that was Ketan Makwana whom just about everybody else instantly saw through with only a fraction of the information available to those who swallowed this fantasy and “accepted” it as a realistic plan to identify a new “owner”.

[+snorbens_caleyman]

22 minutes ago, Charles Bannerman said:

One other thought. Doesn’t it now seem absolutely absurd that several vital weeks over the summer should have been wasted on the delusional chancer that was Ketan Makwana whom just about everybody else instantly saw through with only a fraction of the information available to those who swallowed this fantasy and “accepted” it as a realistic plan to identify a new “owner”.

The thought had occurred to me.... what if he came back now with his offer?

[Yngwie]

4 minutes ago, snorbens_caleyman said:

The thought had occurred to me.... what if he came back now with his offer?

If he came back it would be with a much lower offer! If the club goes into administration it could be sold to any lunatic who comes up with some money. The decision on whether to liquidate or accept any offer gets taken by the administrators, not by people who have ICT’s interests at heart.

[Yngwie]

I see from LinkedIn by the way that Ketan recently obtained some spurious certificate in football club management!

[ClickbaitProponent]

8 minutes ago, Yngwie said:

I see from LinkedIn by the way that Ketan recently obtained some spurious certificate in football club management!

Yep not worth the paper it is printed on. A snakeoil course. Not recognised within the UK ofqual network, and does not meet MBA requirements as it is not underpinned by any academic institute. It's a pay a load of money and whether you pass or fail you get a certificate type of course. Ketan is so full of ***** he could start a rose growing business.

[bishbashbosh]

List of clubs in Scotland that have entered administration

heavier penalties for the second incursion.?

 

Club Entered admin.                         Exited admin      League(s)        Deduction(s) and/or other sanctions

Queen's Park10 January 2000.        3 April 2000.     Third Division.                       None

 Morton 15 December 2000              8 August 2001.  First Division.                        None

Clydebank 23 December 2000.        9 July 2002       Third division.                       None                                  
became airdrie united. 

Airdrieonians 21 May 2002.               Dissolved.           First Division.                       None

Motherwell 24 April 2002                  20 April 2004.     SPL.                                      None

Dundee. 25 November 2003.             6 August 2004.   SPL.                                     None

Livingston 3 February 2004.             13 May 2005.        SPL.                                     None

Gretna.      10 March 2008.                8 August 2008.    SPL                                      −10 pts
Demoted to Third Division.     Dissolved

Livingston 24 July 2009.                   13 August 2009.  First Division.             Demoted to Third Division

Dundee 14 October 2010.                  12 May 2011.         First Division.                      −25 pts

Rangers 14 February 2012.                14 June 2012.       SPL.                                     - 10 pts
(old company in liquidation) After the business and assets of Rangers were sold to a new company,the SPL member clubs refused an application for the Rangers SPL membership share to also be transferred to the new Rangers company. Rangers were instead accepted into the Third Division (fourth tier) for the 2012–13season.

Dunfermline 27 March 2013.          13 December 2013.  First Division.                      −15 pts         

Hearts 19 June 2013.                           11 June 2014.       SPL.                                      −15 pts

[Scotty]

1 hour ago, Charles Bannerman said:

One other thought. Doesn’t it now seem absolutely absurd that several vital weeks over the summer should have been wasted on the delusional chancer that was Ketan Makwana whom just about everybody else instantly saw through with only a fraction of the information available to those who swallowed this fantasy and “accepted” it as a realistic plan to identify a new “owner”.

The scary thing about the statement is it suggests the problem was us not them ... so it seems they still see it as a legitimate offer!!!  

The statement reads "We did seriously consider an approach from 77 Ventures (Ketan Makwana), on which there has been much public comment. However, we suspended these discussions when it became clear that the gap between buyer expectations and seller ability to deliver was unlikely ever to be bridged."

Seriously? Should that not be reversed? This was at the satrt of the statement and set the tone for the rest of the drivel contained therein. 

 

1 hour ago, snorbens_caleyman said:

The thought had occurred to me.... what if he came back now with his offer?

Judging by the statement they would take it!