Leigh Griffiths

[Alex MacLeod]

It would appear that a deal had been done with Wolves that Leigh would transfer to them for ?150k and would be loaned back to Dundee but SFL have refused this on the grounds that the club are not allowed to sign anyone while in administration and this move would be seen as a fresh signing. Has the world of football leadership gone stark raving bonkers? Here's a way that Wolves were going to provide some much needed funds to Dundee that would help them out of admin and the powers that be veto it.

Story here

[CaleyD]

And rightly so.

How can any club in administration offer a contract, even a loan contract, when they don't know if they are going to be in business in a weeks time, let alone 6 months or more?

What benefit is it to the business (or those they owe) to sell a player and then use the money from that sale to pay to loan him back?

They're lucky they still have the ability to put a team of full time players out on the park. To be honest, if I were the authorities, I would already be having a close look at the situation at Dundee as they are obviously still paying inflated wages in order to keep players like Griffiths on the books whilst the club is in administration. The money paid in wages over the last few months would have gone a long way towards providing the additional £150k now on offer for a single player.

I'm afraid the story and comments from Dundee do little more than highlight that they are still to accept that they got themselves into this mess and it's not everyone elses job to get them out of it.

[Alex MacLeod]

And rightly so.

How can any club in administration offer a contract, even a loan contract, when they don't know if they are going to be in business in a weeks time, let alone 6 months or more?

What benefit is it to the business (or those they owe) to sell a player and then use the money from that sale to pay to loan him back? Dundee have 13 players on their books and are fighting for survival. This deal was a way of providing some cash to help in that survival. It would not have cost Dundee to keep the player.

They're lucky they still have the ability to put a team of full time players out on the park. To be honest, if I were the authorities, I would already be having a close look at the situation at Dundee as they are obviously still paying inflated wages in order to keep players like Griffiths on the books whilst the club is in administration. The money paid in wages over the last few months would have gone a long way towards providing the additional ?150k now on offer for a single player. In my view, though they are the administrators of their own destiny, it is important for Scottish football that they do survive. They are not paying inflated wages to keep players. They are, however, adhering to contracts agreed before administration.

I'm afraid the story and comments from Dundee do little more than highlight that they are still to accept that they got themselves into this mess and it's not everyone elses job to get them out of it.

Personally I believe that it is important to our game that they get out of this. This situation could just as easily be us. And in time maybe it will. Who knows? It serves no purpose to be smug about another team in trouble when its obvious that we are struggling to make ends meet.

[Johnboy]

Personally I believe that it is important to our game that they get out of this. This situation could just as easily be us. And in time maybe it will. Who knows? It serves no purpose to be smug about another team in trouble when its obvious that we are struggling to make ends meet.

I agree it is important to the Scottish game that Dundee extricate themselves from the mess they have got themselves in through years of mismanagement.

I wouldn't agree that ICT could just have easily found themselves in the same situation.

Our BoD do come in for a lot stick from time to time, but they have done very well in the club's short history to get then where they are at the present moment.

[Alex MacLeod]

Personally I believe that it is important to our game that they get out of this. This situation could just as easily be us. And in time maybe it will. Who knows? It serves no purpose to be smug about another team in trouble when its obvious that we are struggling to make ends meet.

I agree it is important to the Scottish game that Dundee extricate themselves from the mess they have got themselves in through years of mismanagement.

I wouldn't agree that ICT could just have easily found themselves in the same situation.

Our BoD do come in for a lot stick from time to time, but they have done very well in the club's short history to get then where they are at the present moment.

Yes they have but ask yourself why Mr Sutherland is making statements to the effect that he'll relinquish his stronghold to incur other investment. Like all clubs this one is struggling. Thats the fact.

[CaleyD]

Alex, I've not been in the slightest bit smug in any of my posts about Dundee's situation.

Where do you draw the line with "help" and how much have Dundee, and other clubs, learned from being bailed out in the past? What message does it send out to other teams if you continually forgive indiscretions because you have a soft spot for a team....or whatever other reason you come up with for not being too hard on them? It's typical of the mentality that has not only put football in a mess, but the whole country. Those who break the rules or live beyond their means are lavished with help and kindness, whilst those who struggle by and make do with their lot get feck all in return.

My sympathy for clubs who get themselves into these situations ran out long time ago....not that I would have had much for a team who managed it twice in 7 years anyway. That's a feeling which is compounded by the victim mentality that they have displayed regarding the whole thing. Since day one they've done nothing but blame everyone else and expect everyone else to be bending over backwards to get them out of the mess. If they were truly serious about putting the clubs existence above all else then they would be operating with a squad of part-time players, paying as little as they could in wages and directing every additional penny towards getting the club out of administration.....instead, they seem more concerned with trying to maintain league position and doing deals which circumvent the rules of the sanctions which have been placed upon them.

Of course we are not immune to the possibilities of it happening to us. For me, that's all the more reason to be clamping down on the issues now in order to get rid of a culture which somehow views administration for any team as inevitable and almost acceptable.

[CaleyD]

Why is it so important for the Scottish Game that Dundee get themselves out of this?

They would be missed by their fans, sure, but beyond that the game would not suffer any more than it would from the loss of any other individual team.

In fact, you could probably make a very good argument for Scotland having too many senior teams and it being in the games best interests if it was thinned out a little.....what better way to do that than by getting rid of the teams that are not well run, whilst directing any extra effort into assisting those who are.

[Heilandee]

I don't have any argument with punishments being meted out to clubs who break league rules,but am concerned by the lack of consistency and any regulation or continuity in arriving at decisions and punishments.These decisions are usually arrived at by committees comprising members with vested interests in voting one way or another,encouraging appeals and a sense of victimisation from clubs on the end of these decisions which are made "on the hoof" with no guidelines,rulebooks or independent arbitrators to ensure a fair and fitting punishment for the breach of rules in question.

This ad hoc decision making has been going on for decades with all 3 bodies being guilty of moving goalposts as they see fit and a lack of consistency from administrators.Self interest will always prevail as long as the current system of making up rules as they go along is allowed to continue but suspect it will be ever thus.

[CaleyD]

....and the only time clubs raise the issue of how things are run is when they get themselves into bother and the rules/sanctions don't suit them!!! Then it's everyone elses fault and they should be the ones changing to help the affected club.

Yeah, the SFA/SFL/SPL may be severely lacking in processes which serve to prevent clubs getting themselves into that much trouble, and they are found more than a little wanting when it comes to the procedures that are used to deal with it....but when push comes to shove, they didn't force Dundee to operate outwith it's means and end up landing itself in administration.

[Tichy_Blacks_Back]

Interesting that Wolves have offered 500K for Adam Hammill (Barnsley) formerly Southampton and Blackpool

Adam Hammill (500K)

Age 22

Career Appearances 94

Goals 5

Leigh Griffiths (150K)

Age 20

Career Appearances 103

Goals 46

Not much of a gamble at 150K for a Premiership club....

[Heilandee]

....and the only time clubs raise the issue of how things are run is when they get themselves into bother and the rules/sanctions don't suit them!!!

Precisely! but the rules/sanctions will never suit any penalised club due to the vagaries and lack of consistency which allow any aggrieved clubs to appeal/whinge/whine,whatever you want to call it, as there is no due process and clarity with the regard to the penalties for breach of rules.I haven't heard anyone at Dundee FC ( outwith P&B ) blaming anyone outside our own boardroom for the current or previous financial mismanagement or that anything should be changed to suit our situation.

[Coggiebob]

In today's Daily Record that Griffiths is signing for Wolves and then they are loaning him straight away to St. Johnstone.

[Heilandee]

In today's Daily Record that Griffiths is signing for Wolves and then they are loaning him straight away to St. Johnstone.

The Daily Record really should stop using P+B as a reference source