Under 20s

[fraser]

think the team was:

Esson

Skinner Cooper Devine Watson

Sutherland Laing Morrison Roberts

Ross

Ferguson

Scorer was Sutherland. Very impressive performance from Roberts

[Renegade]

U20 matches won't be the same without George Brislen-Hall! 

[Oddquine]

think the team was:

Esson

Skinner Cooper Devine Watson

Sutherland Laing Morrison Roberts

Ross

Ferguson

Scorer was Sutherland. Very impressive performance from Roberts

 

So the under 20 team consisted of 4 (as far as I can see) over 20 first team signed players, plus Laing who, as far as I can ascertain, is signed to the first team, (going by the Courier blurb when he signed) earning appropriate wages and Cooper who has been benched and has played for the first team, even if ICT may not yet have upped his wages. Devine and Roberts are imports from England,..so of the players in the under 20 team....only Skinner, Watson and Ferguson are homegrown ICT youth players...and the only ones, (apart from Devine who has been here ten minutes) with no first team experience. Heck that bloke with the funny name we don't appear to have signed got more games for the under-20s than most of our own youth players.

 

So excuse me if I am being logical here....but was the whole idea of the under 20 set up not to give a cross between allowing  up to four over 20 (first team ) players (not an obligatory four over 20s) to get match practice after injury etc and the eligible players in the youth system to get accustomed to playing against older, more experienced players, given the lack of a proper reserve league and nothing but the under-20s at a level above the under-17s?   If what ICT is producing is a reserve team-lite...what do the other seven of the signed under 20s do..twiddle their thumbs every week, because there is nowhere for them to get a competitive game?

 

If we are so hard up for cash....why bother with an expensive youth system at all, when we can do as we have been doing over the last couple or so seasons,  taking kids from other clubs, not playing those we have been raising from the age of nine or ten and just punting them at the end of the season?  Why are we paying out for what appears to be crap coaches raising players the ICT management appears to think are crap?

[PullMyFinger]

 

Steady on there, not many youth players manage to make it to the top of the game and that's where we're at now. We do have a few which for a club of our size in a sparcely populated area in not too bad. Our coaching staff do a fantastic job with the resources available to them. If you're expecting to have a steady stream of talent coming out of the Highlands you're setting yourself up for a fall.

 

I don't know why but your posts seem to be painfully negative at a time when we are at the league position we've ever had in January with games in both cup competitions to look forward to. Try smiling before you post and see if that helps.

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Feck me Mr and Mrs Grouch !!

[caleyboy]

think the team was:

Esson

Skinner Cooper Devine Watson

Sutherland Laing Morrison Roberts

Ross

Ferguson

Scorer was Sutherland. Very impressive performance from Roberts

 

So the under 20 team consisted of 4 (as far as I can see) over 20 first team signed players, plus Laing who, as far as I can ascertain, is signed to the first team, (going by the Courier blurb when he signed) earning appropriate wages and Cooper who has been benched and has played for the first team, even if ICT may not yet have upped his wages. Devine and Roberts are imports from England,..so of the players in the under 20 team....only Skinner, Watson and Ferguson are homegrown ICT youth players...and the only ones, (apart from Devine who has been here ten minutes) with no first team experience. Heck that bloke with the funny name we don't appear to have signed got more games for the under-20s than most of our own youth players.

 

So excuse me if I am being logical here....but was the whole idea of the under 20 set up not to give a cross between allowing  up to four over 20 (first team ) players (not an obligatory four over 20s) to get match practice after injury etc and the eligible players in the youth system to get accustomed to playing against older, more experienced players, given the lack of a proper reserve league and nothing but the under-20s at a level above the under-17s?   If what ICT is producing is a reserve team-lite...what do the other seven of the signed under 20s do..twiddle their thumbs every week, because there is nowhere for them to get a competitive game?

 

If we are so hard up for cash....why bother with an expensive youth system at all, when we can do as we have been doing over the last couple or so seasons,  taking kids from other clubs, not playing those we have been raising from the age of nine or ten and just punting them at the end of the season?  Why are we paying out for what appears to be crap coaches raising players the ICT management appears to think are crap?

A lot of what you say is spot on Oddquine. The abolition of the Reserve League certainly has NOT helped any genuine U20's with much needed game time and I just cannot see how our youth development programme can be justified under such circumstances. I don't know how many young pros we have signed this year but if they don't play regularly why bother!

[Alex MacLeod]

Oddquine, we have very good youth coaches. We may even have good players at youth level being coached by these good coaches. Unfortunately, and partly due to our relegation, there is a big gap in age groups. We haven't had the talent come through, in the last season or two, that could do a first team job. Coaches can teach the laws of the game, they can teach how to play the game, they can nurture talent but they cant produce the talent. That is something born into the individual and if it isn't there then it can't come through. I do think you should take a good look at our first team squad and count the number of players that have come through our youth system. Approx 30% of the current squad came through our youth system. I'd say thats a pretty good reflection of what we do.

It is a rule of membership of SPL that we must have a U-20 team. Prior to this season that league was U-19. Prior to that it was a U-21 / reserve league. There is no reserve league so we need to field eligible first team players to give them match experience.

[caleyboy]

Oddquine, we have very good youth coaches. We may even have good players at youth level being coached by these good coaches. Unfortunately, and partly due to our relegation, there is a big gap in age groups. We haven't had the talent come through, in the last season or two, that could do a first team job. Coaches can teach the laws of the game, they can teach how to play the game, they can nurture talent but they cant produce the talent. That is something born into the individual and if it isn't there then it can't come through. I do think you should take a good look at our first team squad and count the number of players that have come through our youth system. Approx 30% of the current squad came through our youth system. I'd say thats a pretty good reflection of what we do.

It is a rule of membership of SPL that we must have a U-20 team. Prior to this season that league was U-19. Prior to that it was a U-21 / reserve league. There is no reserve league so we need to field eligible first team players to give them match experience.

 

Pray tell me Alex how do you know how good our youth coaches are? Oddquine is making some really sensible points and you reply with your usual drivel! My count of first team squad players who have come all the way thru our YDP is Laing, Polworth, Ross & Morrison. From my reckoning Shinnie and Sutherland arrived either at U17 or U19 but I stand to be corrected. Any others I have forgotten?  

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Our coaches are so good that we should get rid of Steve Marsella.

[ictchris]

The Hearts game kicks off at 1:30pm at their Riccarton training ground.

[Alex MacLeod]

Oddquine, we have very good youth coaches. We may even have good players at youth level being coached by these good coaches. Unfortunately, and partly due to our relegation, there is a big gap in age groups. We haven't had the talent come through, in the last season or two, that could do a first team job. Coaches can teach the laws of the game, they can teach how to play the game, they can nurture talent but they cant produce the talent. That is something born into the individual and if it isn't there then it can't come through. I do think you should take a good look at our first team squad and count the number of players that have come through our youth system. Approx 30% of the current squad came through our youth system. I'd say thats a pretty good reflection of what we do.

It is a rule of membership of SPL that we must have a U-20 team. Prior to this season that league was U-19. Prior to that it was a U-21 / reserve league. There is no reserve league so we need to field eligible first team players to give them match experience.

 

Pray tell me Alex how do you know how good our youth coaches are? Oddquine is making some really sensible points and you reply with your usual drivel! My count of first team squad players who have come all the way thru our YDP is Laing, Polworth, Ross & Morrison. From my reckoning Shinnie and Sutherland arrived either at U17 or U19 but I stand to be corrected. Any others I have forgotten?  

Where you and I differ caleyboy is that when I see players being signed as sixteen year olds on the modern equivalent to the schoolboy form and then they sign as first team professionals that is a credit to the coaching they've been given. I don't know what your problem is but this is not the first time you've jumped on me for defending our coaching. If you have issues with the current youth coaches please take it up with them and not me. It's not my fault the highlands are not producing talented footballers. I don't even see them coming through at County and they have the academy on their doorstep.

But in answer to your first question I base my judgement in the fact that our teams at U-16 and below regularly get invited to competitions around europe and regularly do quite well. Not too many Scottish teams get that opportunity.

[Oddquine]

 

Steady on there, not many youth players manage to make it to the top of the game and that's where we're at now. We do have a few which for a club of our size in a sparcely populated area in not too bad. Our coaching staff do a fantastic job with the resources available to them. If you're expecting to have a steady stream of talent coming out of the Highlands you're setting yourself up for a fall.

 

I don't know why but your posts seem to be painfully negative at a time when we are at the league position we've ever had in January with games in both cup competitions to look forward to. Try smiling before you post and see if that helps.

 

I used to get pelters for being a happy clapper as bad, if not worse, than Luke Mackay and CaleyD (sorry for taking your names in vain, people) and now I'm getting pelters for being negative.

 

If the kids never get a chance to play, even at the only level for which they are automatically eligible and the level for which they were signed, how can they be judged?  We can't judge how they can play in a competitive match if they never get to play in one and are continually being shunted aside so we can take in loan players, play under 20's we pull in from other clubs or give fringe over age first team players match practice.

 

I am not saying that the youth system and coaches are crap. I am commenting on the fact that the ICT management appears to think they are.  I am asking, given that appears to be the case, why we continue to pay out silly money on a youth system at all? Are we just playing at it because that is part of what it takes to be in the SPL. 

 

I don't expect a steady stream of talent to be coming out of the Highlands....but I do expect that the few who are identified by the coaches get a fair chance to show  how good bad or indifferent they are..and currently, they don't.

[Kingsmills]

I think Oddquine has made a good point.

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

I think Oddquine has had a few pints.

[caleyboy]

I think Oddquine has had a few pints.

I think it's Alex that's had too many pints

[caleyboy]

 

Oddquine, we have very good youth coaches. We may even have good players at youth level being coached by these good coaches. Unfortunately, and partly due to our relegation, there is a big gap in age groups. We haven't had the talent come through, in the last season or two, that could do a first team job. Coaches can teach the laws of the game, they can teach how to play the game, they can nurture talent but they cant produce the talent. That is something born into the individual and if it isn't there then it can't come through. I do think you should take a good look at our first team squad and count the number of players that have come through our youth system. Approx 30% of the current squad came through our youth system. I'd say thats a pretty good reflection of what we do.

It is a rule of membership of SPL that we must have a U-20 team. Prior to this season that league was U-19. Prior to that it was a U-21 / reserve league. There is no reserve league so we need to field eligible first team players to give them match experience.

 

Pray tell me Alex how do you know how good our youth coaches are? Oddquine is making some really sensible points and you reply with your usual drivel! My count of first team squad players who have come all the way thru our YDP is Laing, Polworth, Ross & Morrison. From my reckoning Shinnie and Sutherland arrived either at U17 or U19 but I stand to be corrected.

Where you and I differ caleyboy is that when I see players being signed as sixteen year olds on the modern equivalent to the schoolboy form and then they sign as first team professionals that is a credit to the coaching they've been given. I don't know what your problem is but this is not the first time you've jumped on me for defending our coaching. If you have issues with the current youth coaches please take it up with them and not me. It's not my fault the highlands are not producing talented footballers. I don't even see them coming through at County and they have the academy on their doorstep.

But in answer to your first question I base my judgement in the fact that our teams at U-16 and below regularly get invited to competitions around europe and regularly do quite well. Not too many Scottish teams get that opportunity.

You either don't want to or can't answer my questions Alex so I take it that your 30% of first team squad is somewhat high.

With regard to invitations to tournaments, I would suggest you don't listen and believe everything you hear. The tournaments our kids play in are not top drawer and very rarely, if ever, include clubs of our status. Celtic, Rangers, Hearts, Aberdeen etc are the clubs invited to tournaments with top English and European teams but this has been the case for many years. For the number of local prospects in our area it just isn't worth employing top quality coaches even if they were available! I expect we will always produce one or two PROSPECTS each year but most won't get passed the U20 grade.

[IMMORTAL HOWDEN ENDER]

Lets just hope that Old Mother Hubbard has made two wicker voodoo dolls and is preparing to inflict pain on PullMyFingeroutofmaerse and Alex McLoud with her size 000 knitting needles.

 

[ICTRoughi]

What time do gates open at these games?