Where did it all go wrong

[dam17]

Where did Caey start to go wrong.

In my opinion it was the Niculae era.

Discuss

[fraser]

I think it may of been when we hired brewster for the second time

[AJS]

When the club decided to stop pursuing new managers and chose the cheap option of bringing back Brewster. Who then got rid of capable players such as Bayne, Wyness, Rankin, Wilson and brought in dead beat like Zadi, Barrowman and McGuire. Then our board failed to see where the club was going and left it too little, too late to save us from the pitfall of relegation which has resulted in us losing our most influential players and being forced to replace them with misfits, nomads and lightweights who have no idea how to play Scottish football.

[SMEE]

Deffo the re-appointment of Brewster. That set the club back years

[starchief]

Yep, re-appointing Brew. Very few wanted him back and he made some serious errors. To think we could have tied down a midfield trio of Black, Rankin (both were made little effort to attempt to keep them) and Cowie (jumping from SFL2 IIRC to SPL - would probably have jumped at a longer contract) if a manager with a bit of vision would have come in then.

[stevico1]

Where did Caey start to go wrong.

In my opinion it was the Niculae era.

Discuss

I don't think that you can pin it down to one thing and there are various things that have gone drastically wrong over the last few years.

I think that the Niculae era could have been handled better by the club, they should have set the record straight that he wasn't earning close to 4k a week at the very start, to this day this amazes me, the guy was getting shot down for what he was reportedly earning and his employers who knew this wasn't the case left him out to dry.

The Savage/Sutherland power struggle had a terrible effect throughout the club.

While with hindsight re-appointing Brewster was a mistake it was a mistake that could have been salvaged if the club had got rid of him before Xmas instead of giving him more money to spend on players when it obviously wasn't working rather than take a new manager and give him a bit of time to get his signings in.

Also one reason and one that I think is one of the most important in putting us in the position we are now is the way the club seem totally unable sort players contracts out when they should have been, we would not have lost a great number of the quality players that we have if these had been carried out in a professional and forward thinking manner and to make matters worse have lost nearly every quality player we have had for next to nothing.

[Alex MacLeod]

Where did Caey start to go wrong.

In my opinion it was the Niculae era.

Discuss

I don't think that you can pin it down to one thing and there are various things that have gone drastically wrong over the last few years.

I think that the Niculae era could have been handled better by the club, they should have set the record straight that he wasn't earning close to 4k a week at the very start, to this day this amazes me, the guy was getting shot down for what he was reportedly earning and his employers who knew this wasn't the case left him out to dry.

The Savage/Sutherland power struggle had a terrible effect throughout the club.

While with hindsight re-appointing Brewster was a mistake it was a mistake that could have been salvaged if the club had got rid of him before Xmas instead of giving him more money to spend on players when it obviously wasn't working rather than take a new manager and give him a bit of time to get his signings in.

Also one reason and one that I think is one of the most important in putting us in the position we are now is the way the club seem totally unable sort players contracts out when they should have been, we would not have lost a great number of the quality players that we have if these had been carried out in a professional and forward thinking manner and to make matters worse have lost nearly every quality player we have had for next to nothing.

Not sure that the contract thing was the reason a number of players left. I think there may be some who didn't want to stay under Brewster. Wages were also a reason some didn't stay. When I spoke to one player about his reason for going his reply was...would you stay in your current job if you were offered three times as much to move.

The Savage/Sutherland power struggle hasn't helped. Bringing back a former manager hasn't helped. As to our current position. At this time of season I actually prefer us being mid table but within touch. The pressure is on the top clubs week in week out and they will crack. Would rather the gap stayed at 4 points though but 7 ain't beyond reach and there's a long way to go yet.

[stevico1]

Where did Caey start to go wrong.

In my opinion it was the Niculae era.

Discuss

I don't think that you can pin it down to one thing and there are various things that have gone drastically wrong over the last few years.

I think that the Niculae era could have been handled better by the club, they should have set the record straight that he wasn't earning close to 4k a week at the very start, to this day this amazes me, the guy was getting shot down for what he was reportedly earning and his employers who knew this wasn't the case left him out to dry.

The Savage/Sutherland power struggle had a terrible effect throughout the club.

While with hindsight re-appointing Brewster was a mistake it was a mistake that could have been salvaged if the club had got rid of him before Xmas instead of giving him more money to spend on players when it obviously wasn't working rather than take a new manager and give him a bit of time to get his signings in.

Also one reason and one that I think is one of the most important in putting us in the position we are now is the way the club seem totally unable sort players contracts out when they should have been, we would not have lost a great number of the quality players that we have if these had been carried out in a professional and forward thinking manner and to make matters worse have lost nearly every quality player we have had for next to nothing.

Not sure that the contract thing was the reason a number of players left. I think there may be some who didn't want to stay under Brewster. Wages were also a reason some didn't stay. When I spoke to one player about his reason for going his reply was...would you stay in your current job if you were offered three times as much to move.

Yes Alex not saying with all, but for example, it was obvious that after a month or so of Cowie first coming he was a player, why not sign him up on a longer term contract then, reason we are short sighted when it comes to things like this

[stevico1]

Where did Caey start to go wrong.

In my opinion it was the Niculae era.

Discuss

I don't think that you can pin it down to one thing and there are various things that have gone drastically wrong over the last few years.

I think that the Niculae era could have been handled better by the club, they should have set the record straight that he wasn't earning close to 4k a week at the very start, to this day this amazes me, the guy was getting shot down for what he was reportedly earning and his employers who knew this wasn't the case left him out to dry.

The Savage/Sutherland power struggle had a terrible effect throughout the club.

While with hindsight re-appointing Brewster was a mistake it was a mistake that could have been salvaged if the club had got rid of him before Xmas instead of giving him more money to spend on players when it obviously wasn't working rather than take a new manager and give him a bit of time to get his signings in.

Also one reason and one that I think is one of the most important in putting us in the position we are now is the way the club seem totally unable sort players contracts out when they should have been, we would not have lost a great number of the quality players that we have if these had been carried out in a professional and forward thinking manner and to make matters worse have lost nearly every quality player we have had for next to nothing.

. As to our current position. At this time of season I actually prefer us being mid table but within touch. The pressure is on the top clubs week in week out and they will crack. Would rather the gap stayed at 4 points though but 7 ain't beyond reach and there's a long way to go yet.

So what you are saying Alex is you are happy we have dropped all the points we have.

[Alex MacLeod]

The other teams in the mix have dropped points too. And will do again.

[stevico1]

The other teams in the mix have dropped points too. And will do again.

Yes agree with that but so will we drop more points, while I see where you are coming from personally I would rather be clear at the top rather than mid table, can you honestly say that at the start of the season you would have chosen us to be in this position at this stage.

[A96]

Where did Caey start to go wrong.

In my opinion it was the Niculae era.

Discuss

Three main reasons:

1. The loss of Darren Dodds and failing to find a suitable replacement in central defence.

2. Yes, you are right - signing Niculae was a big mistake. It unsettled the whole team, broke the team spirit - and while the other players were complaining and refusing to sign contracts, they took their eye off the ball and the team performance suffered. Niculae was a prima donna we couldn't afford. Yes, he was talented but he was lazy. He only scored 8 goals for us and some of these were against the diddiest of opposition.

3. The real fault for ICT being relegated can be laid squarely at the door of the Board. Brewster should have been replaced well before Chritsmas but the Board dithered into January by which time we were in deep trouble. It was clear for all to see by November 2008 that Brewster was failing. Yes, he was a good player and a reasonable player-manager. But he was never going to be a success as a manager. That was plain to see from his time managing Dundee United. Taking him back for a second time was a mistake - but failing to sack him in time is what did the real damage.

Edited November 8, 2009 by A96

[dead_ball_specialist]

When Dargo left, coupled with Brewster getting shot of Morgan, Hart, Wyness, Paatelinen, Wilson and Rankin (i.e. all of our creative players). The goals dried up, the football was mince, and it was all downhill from there.

[caleykid1994]

When Dargo left, coupled with Brewster getting shot of Morgan, Hart, Wyness, Paatelinen, Wilson and Rankin (i.e. all of our creative players). The goals dried up, the football was mince, and it was all downhill from there.

Im glad someone has mentioned it. Losing Dargo(not the clubs fault in anyway shape or form due to him moving back south for his family) and not finding a potent goalscorer to replace him.

The slagging Niculae has got is a joke. He may have only scored 8 goals but he nearly set up ever other one that went in. Losing McAllister, Vigurs, Wood, Leslie etc in other words all the good players that have come through the Academy was a big mistake.

Wyness wasnt as goo dthe 2nd time round and even he knew that moving to Hearts was his biggest mistake. Morgan(rarely saw anything from him), Paatelainen(IMO was never used properly), Wilson was too slow to make any real impact for the team but his experience made up for some of that. Black, Rankin & Cowie should have been nailed down on long term deals long before then but as people have said, we are being run by *monkeys who couldnt peel a banana

edit: * no racism intended there!

Edited November 8, 2009 by caleykid1994

[Fanoffooty]

Where did Caey start to go wrong.

In my opinion it was the Niculae era.

Discuss

Here we go again another thread about the same old .......... get the violins out

[Jay_7]

Good players that have left and not been adequately replaced:

Dods

Dargo

Wyness

Bayne

Rankin

Cowie

Black

Wilson

Vigurs

Niculae

Looking at that list - you can't help but feel that we'd still be in the SPL if Bennet wasn't incompetence personified and actually offered reasonable terms to these players. From that list - Only Dods genuinely wanted a move away from the club so he could be closer to his family. The rest - well we all saw the club time and again play the "personal reasons" card in the press.

Edited November 8, 2009 by Jay_7

[caleykid1994]

Good players that have left and not been adequately replaced:

Dods

Dargo

Wyness

Bayne

Rankin

Cowie

Black

Wilson

Vigurs

Niculae

Looking at that list - you can't help but feel that we'd still be in the SPL if Bennet wasn't incompetence personified and actually offered reasonable terms to these players. From that list - Only Dods genuinely wanted a move away from the club so he could be closer to his family. The rest - well we all saw the club time and again play the "personal reasons" card in the press.

Dargo aswell but he didnt dog round the idea of holding out unlike Black, he told us straight that he wont consider anything til the end of the season and that was anybody. Black just held out as long as he could til another club came in for him.

[Fanoffooty]

I just dont see the point in these "Where did it all go wrong " posts they've been done to death theres nothing anyone can do to change it so move on .

We need to concentrate on the here & now !

[Jay_7]

I just dont see the point in these "Where did it all go wrong " posts they've been done to death theres nothing anyone can do to change it so move on .

We need to concentrate on the here & now !

By identifying where it's all gone wrong - we are identifying who is to blame. IMO the manager is not to blame. Blame lies squarely at the board.

Unfortunately as the blame lies with the board - there is absolutely nothing that any fan will be able to do. All we can do is wait for Savage to make his move and shake things up. Here's hoping he knows someone that would make a good director of football...

[starchief]

Here we go again another thread about the same old .......... get the violins out

I just dont see the point in these "Where did it all go wrong " posts they've been done to death theres nothing anyone can do to change it so move on .

We need to concentrate on the here & now !

If you don't like the thread, no need to read it, much less respond. You don't want to give your opinion? Ignore the thread - but don't tell anyone else they're not entitled to air their views either.

There's nothing we can do about last Saturday's game. Hell, there's nothing we can do about next Saturday's either unless we're Butcher and Malpas disguised, so what's the point of talking about pretty much anything ICT related at all? (the answer is of course: we're interested in the club and are chewing the cud)

[Fanoffooty]

Here we go again another thread about the same old .......... get the violins out

I just dont see the point in these "Where did it all go wrong " posts they've been done to death theres nothing anyone can do to change it so move on .

We need to concentrate on the here & now !

If you don't like the thread, no need to read it, much less respond. You don't want to give your opinion? Ignore the thread - but don't tell anyone else they're not entitled to air their views either.

There's nothing we can do about last Saturday's game. Hell, there's nothing we can do about next Saturday's either unless we're Butcher and Malpas disguised, so what's the point of talking about pretty much anything ICT related at all? (the answer is of course: we're interested in the club and are chewing the cud)

Actually i do want to give my opinion cos i too am interested in the club ! & i'm as much entitled as anyone

Ok i'll re word my initial response to this thread "I think it would be an idea if people tried to move on "

Is that better Starchief ? i dont think i sound like i'm telling anyone what to do now do i ?

:001:

Going round in circles springs to mind :019:

[Jay_7]

Dargo aswell but he didnt dog round the idea of holding out unlike Black, he told us straight that he wont consider anything til the end of the season and that was anybody. Black just held out as long as he could til another club came in for him.

I reckon Dargo would have stayed if he was offered a reasonable deal.

[TSTtiger]

when a certain shareholder started putting himself and his ego before the good of the club.

[AJS]

Dargo aswell but he didnt dog round the idea of holding out unlike Black, he told us straight that he wont consider anything til the end of the season and that was anybody. Black just held out as long as he could til another club came in for him.

I reckon Dargo would have stayed if he was offered a reasonable deal.

He was offered the most expensive contract the club had ever offered. He wanted back down to the central belt, like most players that come up here.

[Scarlet Pimple]

The loss of Dods without re-installing an excellent replacement was the turning point in the declne and fall of ICT.

When you take a shell in a vital part of the ship and then never repair the deep rent properly, the ship will start to sink. No question about that. You cannot neglect such a serious event and get away with it.

If this position had been adequately filled the team could have lost a forward or two but the defence would have had the support it needed right in its heart.The inspiration that Dods also gave to the team went with him.

This would also have steadied the other players , even if they were not quite up to the same standard of heart, workrate and ability as someone like Dods.

This negative event was then compounded by the allowing of good players to leave unsigned. The investment of a few extra pounds in retaining their services would probably have been well worth the sacrifice. The signing of Niculae, for various reasons, was a "good idea at the time" event that went wrong and I think that brinigng in players "out of your league" at such a high salary cannot be a successful strategy for ICT.

The net effect overall has been that sub-standard, inexperienced players have been brought in who not only have not properly fitted in or adjusted to the style of play, but sound more than a little bewildered by the circumstances that are surrounding them--to me it sounds as if there is a lack of adequate direction to the players in the performance of their roles and tasks.

And an overall sense of dispirited attitudes throughout the whole playing staff, not reduced particularly by a Manager who has a disturbing habit of losing his temper and mouthing off too many times, usually at the expense of the players whom he was (hopefully) hired to inspire , in the media, when a calmer more direct approach to individual players might have been, and could be, more successful has not helped .

As I have said before, this team seems to fold under any kind of real pressure and lacks the camaraderie and fighting spirit to put out the effort to overcome this and go on to win . Also The lack of a settled team and too many personnel from England and overseas , instead of the grooming and playing of more home-grown talent, is also a factor IMHO. Firstly, and lastly, how can you expect a 20 + year old player who hails from England to have the spirit of playing for the local team when he barely knows where Loch Ness is, let alone have any affinity whatsoever to Inverness or its folks?