Losing faith in Butcher

[Kylef]

TBH i was never a fan of Butcher, wanted Robbo for the job, and couldnt believe it when he stepped in to the Scotland coaching squad!

But ever since he took over at Caley, i have grown very fond of him. Has his head screwed on, and isnt afraid of telling it like it is. Hope he can do the incredibly difficult task of getting the team to 1st division title glory.

I for one am right behind him, and the club, in doing this!!

[tm4tj]

I don't care either.

Is there something in the water up in Dornoch.

[DornochCaley]

I don't care either.

Is there something in the water up in Dornoch.

Is there some point in that post other than sounding like a complete ****?

[tm4tj]

OK then little boy, is that better.

You have said you don't like Mr Butcher as a man. Do you know him? That is not a very clever statement and a personal attack on a person. What is your personal gripe with Terry Butcher. If you don't know him personally, then don't judge his personal attributes.

[DornochCaley]

OK then little boy, is that better.

You have said you don't like Mr Butcher as a man. Do you know him? That is not a very clever statement and a personal attack on a person. What is your personal gripe with Terry Butcher. If you don't know him personally, then don't judge his personal attributes.

I already stated i dont know him personally but what i have seen from him. I.e Things he says in interviews and to newspapers, he seems a cocky, arogant **** who i dont particualry like.

[Renegade]

Butcher isn't going anywhere. We are just out of August. You can hump and haw all you like, but the board wont act til end of the season, if they even have to at all.

I wouldnt be surprised if some of the players have a right good laugh at some of the fans for their fickleness and moaning

Im not having a dig at anyone, just saying that a lot of people here would go through a manager every 5 games if they could.

:001: Butcher aint perfect but I doubt there are many who could much better. Let's face it, he doesn't exactly have a brilliant team, not a bad one but an alright one. This is my prediction for the rest of the season and possibly beyond and you quote he on it of you like. Butcher's contract ends at the end of the season, if ICT win the 1st Division he'll stay and sign a new contract, if ICT do not win promotion, he won't quit nor will he be sacked, he'll just see out the end of his contract and that will be it. It could well be that ICT will be looking for a new boss after the end of this season, unless they do what I feel is inevitable and give it to Malpas.

[tm4tj]

I am the opposite to that then. His PR and spin is second to none. His managerial qualities are certainly a subject of much discussion, but like most, I am prepared for the longer haul. His previous managerial record is also not fantastic, but there were underlying problems with some of his appointments. For instance, at Sydney, there was a lot of prominent people who did not want Butcher on the payroll. He never got the help he needed and was basically hounded out.

[DornochCaley]

I am the opposite to that then. His PR and spin is second to none. His managerial qualities are certainly a subject of much discussion, but like most, I am prepared for the longer haul. His previous managerial record is also not fantastic, but there were underlying problems with some of his appointments. For instance, at Sydney, there was a lot of prominent people who did not want Butcher on the payroll. He never got the help he needed and was basically hounded out.

When he was a player, he was quoted saying things that i certainly do not like. I cannot recall them off the top of my head but i remember being told something he said one day and since then, i havnt liked him.

[The Mantis]

That, plus the fact that he is a former captain of Rangers FC and Celtic are your big team :001: :angry: :angry:

[alternative maryhill]

OK then little boy, is that better.

You have said you don't like Mr Butcher as a man. Do you know him? That is not a very clever statement and a personal attack on a person. What is your personal gripe with Terry Butcher. If you don't know him personally, then don't judge his personal attributes.

I already stated i dont know him personally but what i have seen from him. I.e Things he says in interviews and to newspapers, he seems a cocky, arogant **** who i dont particualry like.

I don't particularly want to get drawn into your argument, but I find that quite a strange evaluation of TB. Sure, he carries himself with the confidence that someone who was, in his day, a world class player is entitled to do, but I've never found him to be arrogant in interviews. On the contrary, I've been really impressed with the gracious way he's accepted defeats and with the apparently genuine warmth he has shown towards Inverness and towards the fans.

I also don't buy the criticism of his signings, especially given that he was powerless to prevent the loss of Black and Morais. I was frustrated by some tactical decisions in the run-in last season and with the decision to let Vigurs go, but I've been fairly encouraged by the way he's set out the team this season and by most of his signings, especially given the limitations he had to work within and the little time they've had to settle into a largely new team.

There's no way the club will think about changing the manager before the end of TB's contract, and that's the way it should be. He needs at least this season and probably half of the next before we can truly evaluate whether the club is moving forward, consolidating or going backwards. Anyone who expects a season in the first division to be relatively plain sailing probably hasn't been following the club long enough to remember the five seasons we spent down here, finishing 6th, 4th, 6th and 4th before finally winning the title.

Edited to add: DornochCaley, I've just read your post which refers to comments Butcher made as a player, which slightly negates my opening paragraph. All the same, plenty of people have said daft things in their younger days. Is that really a reason to dislike him 'as a man' 20-odd years later, regardless of what you think of him as a manager?

Edited September 6, 2009 by alternative maryhill

[Renegade]

I am the opposite to that then. His PR and spin is second to none. His managerial qualities are certainly a subject of much discussion, but like most, I am prepared for the longer haul. His previous managerial record is also not fantastic, but there were underlying problems with some of his appointments. For instance, at Sydney, there was a lot of prominent people who did not want Butcher on the payroll. He never got the help he needed and was basically hounded out.

The media didn't help with that either. "Coffeegate" being another example that also turned some people against him.

[Locutus]

Give DornochCaley a break.

If my reading of his posts is correct then he's just a young laddie who's tried to jump on the 'sack Butcher' bandwagon that's been created by a couple of users (with questionable affiliation to the club) and has quickly found himself out of his depth when challenged on, or asked to explain, them.

I'd be surprised if he was even born when Butcher was playing, let alone old enough to remember any comments he might have made back then.

[TinRoofMan]

The man with the non-Midas touch...

FYI

Thats called the Sidam touch....

[jaggie1994]

Personally I love the way Butcher talks to the media. Some of the comments he makes are classic. One today was "I limited myself to just the 3 bottles of wine instead of the usual 4 last night" in celebration of the scotland game. I think that is great to have in an interview. It shows that he his just having a laugh pretty much and I reckon it will get a few people on our side and when you are a small club you need everyone you can get.

I want Butcher to stay untill the end of the season unless we are in the bottom half of the table with no hope of promotion in January. He needs to be given a fair crack of the whip. We gave Brewster a hell of a lot of time so I reckon we should give Butcher the time he needs this season.

We have only lost one game this season and if you didnt know the results and were looking on this forum you would think we are bottom of the league with no points and that the whole club was about to collapse when actually we have had one terrible game and apart from that we are doing pretty well.

[RiG]

That, plus the fact that he is a former captain of Rangers FC and Celtic are your big team :lol:

Spot. On.

[ForCaleySake]

Are you sure your name's not Terry?

...Heh...well someone's gotta defend m....him :/

[Scarlet Pimple]

Dornoch Caley is young and inexperienced and tends to shoot from the hip. Yet some of his past comments have been quite well thought out as I recall. And his heart does lie with Caley Thistle.

When the Scarlet One was 16 his mother told a family friend , referring to S.P., that he "was not backward at coming forward" and I still don't know whether that was good or bad. I.e. let's not tear DC down every time he pipes up. Go gently into the night DC and come again to the fray, remembering that positive personal comments about individuals, especially untried ones, is preferable to negative ones.

For example, I liked Alternative Maryhill's posting which was moderate and thoughtful.

And although Manfer The Job does a wonderful prematch preview commentary with what appears to me to be great accuracy, even if his head is probably getting bigger by the minute, I wish he would not lurk in his den, sallying out only occasionally to hit the Pimple with jolly japes and jibes that the latter fan finds very wounding and negative. His personal, rapier like, attacks on S.P. are quite scurrillous and quite without foundation in view of the fact that Scarlet is such a fine fellow who never attacks anyone-----without justification.

[absent friend]

Give DornochCaley a break.

If my reading of his posts is correct then he's just a young laddie who's tried to jump on the 'sack Butcher' bandwagon that's been created by a couple of users (with questionable affiliation to the club)

and (DC) has quickly found himself out of his depth when challenged on, or asked to explain, them.

I'd be surprised if he was even born when Butcher was playing, let alone old enough to remember any comments he might have made back then.

What an excellent post - says a lot with the minimum of words.

.

[BEE123]

As a Brentford fan reading through this there's a depressing sense of deja vu.

First come the defeats against teams you should be beating (for Ross County, read Grimsby), then come the rallying calls and claims of bad days at the office, followed by excuses of small playing budgets, not getting support from his backroom team etc. His team changed everyweek, he didnt pick good players because he took a dislike to them and made bizarre substitutions (sound familiar?)All the while he is on the radio "talking a good game" whilst his side slips further down the table. Don't believe this man's PR and spin - he can talk the talk, but when it comes down to it he is tactically inept, playing championship manager formations and team selections.

When he was with us many fans had the same arguments - "who could do better with the budget/who could get the team to perform with this group of players?" etc as we slid ever further to non-league football. With the more or less the same group of players our current manager took us up the next season, showing that despite a small budget, tactical astuteness, knowledge of good league players and drive is far more important than "talking a good game." For further proof, he actually said it wasn't his job as manager to motivate the players!

You deserve better and I believe he'll be gone before Christmas, complaining that he didn't have any support or that the budget was too small.

Good luck

[The Mantis]

Andy Scott? OK, send him up

[DALNEIGHCALEY]

No no no BEE123 you dont understand , since he's come here all his past disasters dont matter as he's the Messiah and in most of our fans eyes he can do no wrong .

[Caley Stan]

His team changed everyweek, he didnt pick good players because he took a dislike to them and made bizarre substitutions (sound familiar?)

Yip, it sounds like Craig Brewster.

Since Butcher took over the line-up has been very settled and nobody has complained about his subs. The vast majority of our fans think we have improved under his stewardship and want to see him in charge for the rest of the season.

Come back then and we can talk about it.

[Johnboy]

His team changed everyweek, he didnt pick good players because he took a dislike to them and made bizarre substitutions (sound familiar?)

Yip, it sounds like Craig Brewster.

Since Butcher took over the line-up has been very settled and nobody has complained about his subs. The vast majority of our fans think we have improved under his stewardship and want to see him in charge for the rest of the season.

Come back then and we can talk about it.

I thought his subs on Sunday helped PT get back into the game - especially taking off Sanchez for Barrowman...

[Guest birdog]

Since Butcher took over the line-up has been very settled and nobody has complained about his subs. The vast majority of our fans think we have improved under his stewardship and want to see him in charge for the rest of the season.

Come back then and we can talk about it.

I want to see us keep in touch with the top slot, as promised with the bounce right back, IF we lose sight can I talk to you about it? I do NOT expect us to win the league this year, I DO expect a decent challenge. If we don't challenge, ie don't improve, then I will re assess my views on Butcher. Yes I hope voices like this put the pressure on, the pressure is needed this season and with it we might just get back up there.

Credit when it's due, if it comes.

[Caley Stan]

I want to see us keep in touch with the top slot, as promised with the bounce right back, IF we lose sight can I talk to you about it? I do NOT expect us to win the league this year, I DO expect a decent challenge. If we don't challenge, ie don't improve, then I will re assess my views on Butcher. Yes I hope voices like this put the pressure on, the pressure is needed this season and with it we might just get back up there.

Credit when it's due, if it comes.

Of course you can birdog.

I was just trying to point out to BEE123 that comparisons between Butcher's time at Brentford and his time here are not relevant at this point.