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Whats the solution? What are you going to do?


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Right guys, i'm going to open a can of worms up here.

That was an absolutely disgraceful attendance today. I actually can't believe that. First home game of the season. "Sell out Saturday". Our club needs us. All these so called fans that wouldn't go back unless Rangers were voted out. New players on display. Very good performance away last week. Add to that the amazing(for once!) weather we had today. After all that we could only muster a 2800 home support. Shocking. I really dont know what we have to do to get all these glory hunters in more often.

And then we look back to last week. 1st game of the season. All the optimism that every team carries into the new campaign and we take down about 250. The people that travelled last week were amazing and I thought the atmosphere was superb but you have to say that was a shocking away support. Dundee (although a much bigger club) took 3000 to Killie. St Johnstone took nearly 1000 to Hearts. I would estimate out of that 250, probably 100-150 were based down south meaning only 100-150 actually bothered their arse going from Inverness. Out of an average home gate of 3000 that is nothing short of embarassing. Why is nobody backing this club?

Basically what I am getting at here is what are we going to do to sort this out? I'm sure a lot of people wont like this, but what exactly do these 'Caley Jags Together' do? What has the trust or the supporters club ever done to rectify this and try to bring in the fans? They like to think of themselves as pro-active, but name me something productive they have done to boost attendances? Maybe they need to start thinking out of the box, rather than living in the dark ages, we might start to inspire a new band of fans. I doubt the loyalty of some of these fans in the 'Caley Jags Together' and I would like to know what the 'Leader' Peter Murphy thinks needs to be done to bring in more support. It would be a lot more productive knowing what he thought rather than him just being the poster boy for the group in the paper all the time along with a few others.

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The Board of Caley Jags Together....and I'm assuming that is who you are having a pop at....can only do so much without the help of others, and it is that which they try to encourage. Ultimately

What is wrong with a lot of folk on here! I agree that the attendance today was disappointing but to have a go at the very folk who are trying to change things for the fans is ludicrous. Peter Murphy

Well, chaps and chapesses, I am pleased to add a positive note to my last post. Today I received a very nice email from Mr Cameron, apologising for the delay in acknowledging my letter to the clu

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Some fair points there, and there's no question it was a woeful (and quite embarrassing) attendance. However if you are going to have a go at others (groups or individuals) for not being pro-active enough and doing more to bolster support you really should be presenting ideas yourself no? Why not join CJT (only a quid for life) or contact the club and tell them what they should be doing better.

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What is wrong with a lot of folk on here! I agree that the attendance today was disappointing but to have a go at the very folk who are trying to change things for the fans is ludicrous. Peter Murphy and all the guys at Caley Jags Together work sooo hard behind the scenes all for no financial reward. Today there was free hospitality for fans for instance. Just a few weeks ago there was the kids kick about day with loads of kids having a fab time with the players and free stadium tours. These things don't just organise themselves. If the OP has ideas that can increase attendances then why not contact he club or the guys on the board of Caley Jags Together with ideas instead of having a go at the folk that work hardest to change things!

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Some fair points there, and there's no question it was a woeful (and quite embarrassing) attendance. However if you are going to have a go at others (groups or individuals) for not being pro-active enough and doing more to bolster support you really should be presenting ideas yourself no? Why not join CJT (only a quid for life) or contact the club and tell them what they should be doing better.

Where is the benefit in me joining it? I would quite happily contact the people involved and tell them what they should be doing better. Do you really think they doing everything they can?

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Some fair points there, and there's no question it was a woeful (and quite embarrassing) attendance. However if you are going to have a go at others (groups or individuals) for not being pro-active enough and doing more to bolster support you really should be presenting ideas yourself no? Why not join CJT (only a quid for life) or contact the club and tell them what they should be doing better.

Where is the benefit in me joining it? I would quite happily contact the people involved and tell them what they should be doing better. Do you really think they doing everything they can?

Why are you sitting back expecting others to sort things?

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What is wrong with a lot of folk on here! I agree that the attendance today was disappointing but to have a go at the very folk who are trying to change things for the fans is ludicrous. Peter Murphy and all the guys at Caley Jags Together work sooo hard behind the scenes all for no financial reward. Today there was free hospitality for fans for instance. Just a few weeks ago there was the kids kick about day with loads of kids having a fab time with the players and free stadium tours. These things don't just organise themselves. If the OP has ideas that can increase attendances then why not contact he club or the guys on the board of Caley Jags Together with ideas instead of having a go at the folk that work hardest to change things!

The free hospitality that was offered today? Is that the big idea to get hundreds pouring back through the gate. The kids day was a great idea but to be honest that should be the norm for a football club

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Some fair points there, and there's no question it was a woeful (and quite embarrassing) attendance. However if you are going to have a go at others (groups or individuals) for not being pro-active enough and doing more to bolster support you really should be presenting ideas yourself no? Why not join CJT (only a quid for life) or contact the club and tell them what they should be doing better.

Where is the benefit in me joining it? I would quite happily contact the people involved and tell them what they should be doing better. Do you really think they doing everything they can?

The benefit surely would be that you could help improve the club's standings with the supporters. You're of course entitled to your view but you are going to make more of a difference working through a group with hundreds of members than a post in the internet. I don't know much about CJT as I only joined the other week, but to knock folk trying to help the club voluntarily is sad imo.

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The Board of Caley Jags Together....and I'm assuming that is who you are having a pop at....can only do so much without the help of others, and it is that which they try to encourage.

Ultimately they are there to represent the fans, to take forward and try and execute the ideas they bring forward to improve things for the fans and to try and increase attendance and support as a result.

They were responsible for the free tickets for schools and youth groups initiatives the club now have in place....they (the then Supporters Trust) spent several season purchasing season tickets which we made available to these groups and in doing so we proved the merits of such a scheme to the club who have since taken it on board and hugely expanded on it.

They have supported Street League level football for as long as I can remember, they provided assistance with travelling for Youth level football at the club during a time or particular hardship...and continue to offer assistance as and when they can and when it is needed. They took up the fans case with the club over the summer over the whole Rangers fiasco (despite many fans letting themselves down by not following through on promises). They went to bat for the guys in (the then) section G when their was problems with over zealous stewarding. They've assisted with two very successful kids kickaround sessions this year which brought a total of near 250 kids on to the park and gave them the chance to meet and play a bit of football with the players. Many of the things the club are being praised for recently have also been driven and supported by Caley Jags Together.

Individuals from within the organisation assist on matchdays with a whole host of things from selling programmes and half time draw tickets to stadium announcing, operating the clubs matchday media operations (previews, reports, videos and interviewing), as well as assisting with the website and driving it towards the product the fans want/desire. CJT members were also in there helping the club stuff envelopes at renewal time, allowing the club to get all letters out in a much reduced timescale (the result of other goings on outwith the clubs control). They sat down with the club when season ticket prices and packages were being set and advised where appropriate/relevant.

And all of the above does not include the hundreds of hours put in to organising and running fund-raising events which are operated in order to provide the money which allows these things to be achieved.

In fact, I could confidently say that there's not a day goes by when someone or other from CJT is not in communication with the club over something.

All of the above has been achieved despite our only having maybe 15 or so "active" participants when it comes to doing a little bit more than buying a ticket and turning up at a match.....imagine what could be achieved if we had 100 people willing to do the same?

I could (literally) give you a list of 100+ other things that we would love to do....but we can't do it by ourselves.

There's some individuals who spend 20, 30, 40 hours (unpaid) a week (sometimes a lot more) doing stuff to help club and fans.....so please don't come on here all mouth and no action, questioning the loyalties of anyone within CJT.

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I would have thought by now people would have given up on this debacle. Its about time people accept as a club we don't appeal to a massive market.

The attendances this season have dropped and will continue to do so. The appeal of playing in SPL has long disappeared as we play the same teams over and over again.

Standard of SPL football is nowhere near level for value of money and the standard is getting worse. We don't play attractive football with a home record to test the most optimistic of fans i find it staggering that people think that they can appeal for fans to come in.

Regardless of how hard these groups try to boost attendances it wont work that is the truth the sooner people realize that the better we have nothing going for ourselves.

I say that with no happiness but its the sad truth.

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I've just done some maths there and out of Ross County's squad that played Aberdeen, there was....and wait for it - 1366 Caley Thistle appearances (Out of Tokely, Munro, Duncan, Fraser and Vigurs). Out of all the players that played for ICT at the Caley Stadium against Kilmarnock, there was......478 Caley Thistle combined appearances - 143 of which were Ryan Esson's. Ross Tokely has more ICT appearances that today's entire squad combined, and taking away Esson's appearances, the total for the ICT outfield players was 335. That's less than both Munro and Duncan's respective appearances.

And therein lies the problem. People are starting to feel dissatisfied and unattached to the club the once felt a part of - and Terry Butcher is to blame. Long ball football, strangers coming and going and a team playing more not to lose than to win - and we wonder why season tickets are down. It's not the club we once knew and I feel it too. It'll be a long time - if ever, that we have something we can truly believe in happening again and that's not nostalgia talking - that's facts.

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Caleytillidie - I am not going to quote most of your post and respond to it as its already been done ..... I actually agree with the point you are making (the low attendance etc), however, I cant help feel you are aiming your potshots at entirely the wrong group.

Basically what I am getting at here is what are we going to do to sort this out?

I will however quote that one part of your post and ask the same question as I have asked anyone who has ever asked that type of question before ...... What have you done?, or given that you happily used the expression "we", then what are some of your suggestions that could be collaborated on ......?

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Right guys, i'm going to open a can of worms up here.

I wouldn't say you were opening a can of worms. I'd say you were making yourself out to be more stupid than you probably are. To apportion blame for the crap support on the trust and on Peter Murphy is just plain pathetic. Those people do a lot of hard work on behalf of the fans of this club that most of us dont see. These are not the folk who should be convincing others through the gates. That part is down to you and I.

As for number of travelling fans. My reckoning at paisley was more like 400 which is the norm for a travelling support.

Now if you really are concerned and you have ideas then why not get involved instead of just mouthing of on here behind a pseudonym.

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Ctid's post sounds like it's born out of frustration and done in the heat of the moment. Let you off (this time).

For all but the die-hards, football's an entertainment business. If we were a cinema and all we showed were 1960s B movies we'd expect empty sets. There's no shotage of alternative outdoor entertainment in the middle of August to compete with, not to mention some televised sport going on down south. The answer, my friend,lies on the pitch.

The stewards could do their bit to help too;l

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I looked at the OP last night, then thought no I'll not respond. Looked at it again and still thought the same this morning but I can't sit around here and not reply to what represents the downside of the "keyboard warrior" mentality that hides behind a user name with no accountability and then takes whatever prompted this post out on named individuals in Caley Jags Together. I, like Don, could list a myriad of achievements of the Supporter's Trust AND the Supporter's Club (not least joining together to raise the profile in a year where we really need as many supporters as we can get) I could also list a number of fundraising and fan involvement plans that are happening in the near future. Don also highlights the hours of unpaid and skilled work that the board do and for what? To be denigrated in a five minute post that took less than five seconds of brainpower to compose. Any more and you would have thought the better of it.

I know that Kenny Cameron and Terry Butcher read these forums, and they must absolutely despair. As I have said elsewhere, they have responded to everything that the fans asked for last year ( better style of football, more community involvement and the right response to the RFC debacle) and still they get some fans complaining about the poor value of season tickets that they never bought, football that they can't be arsed watching and events that they can't be bothered supporting. It's a bit like watching the neds sniggering behind the bikeshed watching the motivated ones doing something.

Rant over. Tell you what OP - I'm on the board of Caley Jags Together. My name's Davie Balfour and if you PM me, I'll give you my phone number so that we can talk this one through instead of sniping on the internet. Deal?

dited for spelling (again)

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Here's our home record in recent SPL seasons

2007/08 - P19 W9 D2 L8 F32 A28

2008/09 - P19 W4 D5 L10 F18 A27

2010/11 - P19 W7 D4 L8 F25 A24

2011/12 - P19 W5 D5 L9 F19 A27

We are poor at home. One season in the last four with a winning record? If we won games and scored goals then more people would show up. Also, and I don't want to go on about pricing, but it's expensive. I paid £26 for a walk up Main Stnd ticket yesterday. Our 'hardcore' fans will always go no matter what but to increase attendances you need to attract more of the casual, walk up fans who go to big games to attend regularly. The best way to do that is to be good. As it stands we are asking people to pay a lot of money for something that's likely not be that good.

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The crowd yesterday was a bit low. There were not as many Killie fans as have been in the past. But to be fair we were only three hundred or so short of comparable fixtures in previous seasons.

I do wonder though about a couple of thoughts in my head. How many of our so called fans were also Rangers fans that didn't travel so came along to watch us but are now boycotting?

How many came to watch us in SPL but were really County supporters?

Just a couple of points to ponder. For now I'd wait a few games to see what the averages are before worrying.

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People are still on holibobs. Attendances are usually a little on the low side until kids go back to school and everything has returned to normal. if after half a dozen games, the trend is continuing, then, its maybe the time to start looking into the reason behind it.

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What is wrong with a lot of folk on here! I agree that the attendance today was disappointing

The crowd yesterday was a bit low.

Ok we all know this forum has more than it's fair share of happy clappers but this was SELL OUT SATURDAY FFS

The attendance was not dissapointing or a bit low it was an absolute disgrace and downright embarrassing when the emphasis was to fill stadia across the land yesterday

3487 watched Partick v Falkirk in the league below us!!!! 4485 watched the Newco Orcs at Peterhead in div 3!!!

Whether we like it or not the vast majority of Invernessians are NOT ICT fans and if it was not for the influx of incomers settling into the city over the last two decades I fear our attendances would have been a lot worse

To be honest I think Caleyjagsforever have their work cut out but I wish them well on the journey ahead

Dougal

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At the end of the day this forum is all about feckin opinions. From my perspective great things are being done off the park but you only will get peeple coming through the turnstiles when things are getting better ON the park.

So if Kenny Cameron is logged on - well done sir. If Mr Terry Butcher is logged on - stop being so feckin tunnel feckin visioned.

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I've just done some maths there and out of Ross County's squad that played Aberdeen, there was....and wait for it - 1366 Caley Thistle appearances (Out of Tokely, Munro, Duncan, Fraser and Vigurs). Out of all the players that played for ICT at the Caley Stadium against Kilmarnock, there was......478 Caley Thistle combined appearances - 143 of which were Ryan Esson's. Ross Tokely has more ICT appearances that today's entire squad combined, and taking away Esson's appearances, the total for the ICT outfield players was 335. That's less than both Munro and Duncan's respective appearances.

And therein lies the problem. People are starting to feel dissatisfied and unattached to the club the once felt a part of - and Terry Butcher is to blame. Long ball football, strangers coming and going and a team playing more not to lose than to win - and we wonder why season tickets are down. It's not the club we once knew and I feel it too. It'll be a long time - if ever, that we have something we can truly believe in happening again and that's not nostalgia talking - that's facts.

Utter nonsense. It is only the fact that some people continuallybring this up that keeps this as an issue. Of course more local players help maintain local interest but were Duncan or Tokely locals lads, no they were not. You support your local team and I think the club are trying to work through the community to get some support as Caley D mentions in his post but sadly the local population just do not want to respond but please stop this drivel about Butcher changing the makeup of the team being responsible for declining attendances as it is simply not the case. Oh and by the way, the constant droning on about long ball football is also becoming tiresome. If you listen to Butcher at home games, he is urging the ball to be kept on the deck, it is the players, perhaps due to the Scottish mentailty, that resort to the long ball and we are not the only team that does this. Why, even Kilmarnock did this yesterday but that spoils a good moan if that is not mentioned.

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Utter nonsense. It is only the fact that some people continuallybring this up that keeps this as an issue. Of course more local players help maintain local interest but were Duncan or Tokely locals lads, no they were not...........please stop this drivel about Butcher changing the makeup of the team being responsible for declining attendances as it is simply not the case

Oh dear looks like I have another stalker! I never said Tokely and Duncan were local (more local than the likes of Gnapka and others mind!), but they were mainstays who the fans felt made the team as recognisable on a weekly basis, season after season - it was almost like you knew them (along with Munro and others who have departed over the last few years). That was also the reason given by a few on here as to reasons they've heard about why some have renewed season tickets.

Oh and by the way, the constant droning on about long ball football is also becoming tiresome.

Tiresome to watch as well I'm afraid and I'm not going to change my views on something just because you don't like it, I'll call it as I see it. Incidentally, both Sydney's and Brentford's average attendances dropped under Butcher's reign. The reason given - the long ball. Bore the fans and they'll turn away and so far, they are.

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