sectarian chants

[wynthank15]

5 minutes ago, dougiedanger said:

I would have thought even Sevco would have responded to such a sectarian outburst by one of their players.

Not only is the club silent, you have guys on here defending it. Shocking stuff.

No one is defending it, as Christians we are taught to love our neighbour of whatever belief , Romanist, Muslim, Buddist but the comments of  Bdu 98196 displays all the prejudices of the Roman inquisition. If no one accepts guilt you are all guilty, all must atone, no appeals. That said, why should anyone have respect to the Pope who has usurped the place of Christ. who says to followers of the Roman sect "come out of her my people that ye be not partakers of her sins and that ye receive not of her plagues" Rev18:4.

Note: MY people. Roman Catholics are MY brethren and I have many RC friends whom I hope to convert to the true path before this life is done.

[Caley Stan]

Jesus wept...

[dougiedanger]

Have I logged on to Follow Follow here ffs?

Bizarre stuff.

[ymip]

Someone, anyone, please delete this thread. Worse than the video if that's possible.  Fckn embarrassment on all fronts.

[bdu98196]

Thread should stay as it demonstrates the abhorrent attitude of the club by it's silence and the acceptance by fans that religious hate crimes are acceptable. Deleting the thread means we are happy to ignore the issue.

We've seen the rise of public racism in football and anti-Semitism recently covered on the media so its maybe not a surprise but it must be ironic that we had threads and posts in the past condemning OF fans for the bile they sing and chant when visiting but now it's out club and players in the spotlight it appers to be accepted. Right now this incident and thread represents a new low for the club IMO and if this is seen as the behaviour and public views that are transcended both on and off the pitch by club and fans then I'll need to consider whether it's a place I will return myself or with family.

[Kingsmills]

7 hours ago, wynthank15 said:

No one is defending it, as Christians we are taught to love our neighbour of whatever belief , Romanist, Muslim, Buddist but the comments of  Bdu 98196 displays all the prejudices of the Roman inquisition. If no one accepts guilt you are all guilty, all must atone, no appeals. That said, why should anyone have respect to the Pope who has usurped the place of Christ. who says to followers of the Roman sect "come out of her my people that ye be not partakers of her sins and that ye receive not of her plagues" Rev18:4.

Note: MY people. Roman Catholics are MY brethren and I have many RC friends whom I hope to convert to the true path before this life is done.

I have no objection to those who believe in some supreme being for which there is absolutely no evidence for and ample evidence against.

However what I do object to is those who have a mission to CONVERT those of us who, in their opinion, have taken the wrong path.

Religion is at the root of much of the conflict in the world today and for the last two thousand years.

If you want to worship then it is your right to do so but please don't shove that nonsense down our throats.  As for converting your Catholic 'brethren' what dangerous  arrogance 

Edited December 18, 2018 by Kingsmills

[+roarer]

Acceptance by fans of religious hate crimes -really ? Tad hysterical don't you think ?

[+Gringo]

1 hour ago, Kingsmills said:

Religion is at the root of much of the conflict in the world today and for the last two thousand years.

If you want to worship then it is your right to do so but please don't shove that nonsense down our throats.  As for converting your Catholic 'brethren' what arrogance 

100% agree. 

[Eagle4Caley]

My impression is that this is someone being a bit of a **** and thinking he is clever or funny, dropping this into the song  like this. It could be the drink talking, but clearly some individual has an underlying issue...aside from stupidity. I was going to say I'm disappointed that this has happened at a club where I didn't expect it, but in reality I never under-estimate the ability of a young male to act up under the influence. Sectarianism does seem to be a bit of problem North of the border, Down here we just have to deal with casual and not so casual racism, and the re-emergence of anti-Semitism (although much of this seems linked to Palestine and the Left, and political point-scoring). Of course social media makes things worse as it is so easy to get caught out...which in one way is a good thing, but of course offence is caused before the attitude can be challenged.

I suspect that the club is looking in to it, and will take the appropriate action, which might not be sacking but the use of suitable life-coaching (and a fine of course).

[buckett]

10 hours ago, wynthank15 said:

Note: MY people. Roman Catholics are MY brethren and I have many RC friends whom I hope to convert to the true path before this life is done.

It may surprise you to know that followers of every religion maintain the arrogant belief that theirs is the only true path! Even the Free Presbyterians!!!

And it would be a fallacy to suggest that the Rangers/Celtic thing (which, lets face it, is what this is all about!) is motivated by religion . It is motivated by hatred, and religion is only an excuse.

Edited December 18, 2018 by buckett
Put bracketed bit in the right place.

[+Gringo]

16 hours ago, Shorty said:

With a player jailed and austin guilty of doing over 100mph on A9 and fighting in our own dugout and other things rumoured you have to wonder where the discipline has gone at the club.  We can't blame that on a lack of money.

We can't you're right. Something has certainly gone pear shaped with the discipline but in the case of RC I believe that incident occurred prior to his arrival at ICT. Unfortunately he was on our books when the case came up and dragged our clubs name through the media and we know what those vultures are like. As far as the video is concerned I struggle to understand why any player would want to post this crap on social media knowing that the vultures will pick it up. I don't condone what was allegedly said of course but players have to be very careful and be more responsible.

[Weekend Hacker]

It's all I got......

Wow

[Caley Stan]

54 minutes ago, buckett said:

And it would be a fallacy to suggest that the Rangers/Celtic thing is motivated by religion (which, lets face it, is what this is all about!). It is motivated by hatred, and religion is only an excuse.

I agree completely with that, but it sits at odds with your previous post. Irish Catholics are hated in Scotland, not because of their religious choices, but because they belong to or were  descended from a large group of migrant 'others'. That's where the parallel with racism comes in.

[buckett]

28 minutes ago, Caley Stan said:

 Irish Catholics are hated in Scotland, 

Maybe a bit of an over-generalisation there, in my opinion anyway.

I certainly have no issue with Irish Catholics and haven't witnessed this sort of thing in the part of Scotland I inhabit, but I take your point if you're referring to the Strathclyde region.

[Gregor]

2 hours ago, roarer said:

Acceptance by fans of religious hate crimes -really ? Tad hysterical don't you think ?

Have to agree the team went on a night out sang songs which some now want to deem religious hate crimes.

It appeared to me that the lads were all having a good time and it was a bonding session , whilst I think it was unwise to use the term used it certainly wasn’t religious hate. 

I’m sure these guys all see this as banter but it should be pointed out to them in future that this would be well steered clear of and also to point out to stop taking videos and posting online .

We are all getting in a froth in this country about a harmless night out while our government are banning Gingerbread men

Whole country has gone to the dogs and needs to get a grip on reality

 

[Gregor]

3 hours ago, Kingsmills said:

I have no objection to those who believe in some supreme being for which there is absolutely no evidence for and ample evidence against.

However what I do object to is those who have a mission to CONVERT those of us who, in their opinion, have taken the wrong path.

Religion is at the root of much of the conflict in the world today and for the last two thousand years.

If you want to worship then it is your right to do so but please don't shove that nonsense down our throats.  As for converting your Catholic 'brethren' what dangerous  arrogance 

See here is a wee thing I could find what you have said to a fellow fan , saying what he believes as nonsense,more offensive than what was said on the team bus

However I wouldn’t want you sacked for it or disciplined by your employers for it.

Im not a RC but I’m a Christian and I do understand that RCs may find the term FTP offensive but as Christians we have to turn the other cheek as Christ taught us.

What annoys me is the faux outrage that goes on today as we live in a blame culture and there is always some do gooder wanting someone to be punished for minor issues.

Maybe if we adopted what Jesus said when he caught a women in adultery 

He said to all the accusers who wanted her punished

He who is without sin cast the first stone

Maybe we should all think about this before we criticise 

Anyway Kingsmills I have no problem with you thinking I’m stupid for having a faith in God and I wish you and your family a very happy Christmas and a great new year.

 

Edited December 18, 2018 by Gregor

[Jack Waddington]

In all honesty, I don't see anything wrong with it (yes, I know, unpopular opinion), it's simply banter.

1. They're boozed up, we all do stupid stuff when on the beer.

2. They're not personally attacking anyone, realistically, if the only one I can see being (slightly) offended is probably Aaron, because he's the only Irish lad left at the club, and would have Catholic heritage, but if he was that irritated about it, he would've gone to Robbo or the Chairman personally and privately and explained the situation. But again, they're not targeting anyone, all they're saying is "**** the pope", and Austin, no doubt has had a private word with Graham and the Board.

3. As for your "sack them all if the guilty party won't own up" comment, do you want this club to exist? If we continuously sack players any time they get into controversy we'll have neither the youth players or funds to replace them. Riccardo's sacking was justifiable, because it was physical assault, but this, this is verbal assault against nobody. I highly doubt the pope is going to find the video and say "This Nathan Austin guy is a wee ***** for saying this about me, going to knock his lights out for that", literally nobody but the PC Patrol and maybe a handful of Catholics would actually be offended by the video. It's like when what's his face from Dundee United blacked up for a party, literally nobody cared, except the people who were getting offended for people who weren't them...

 

[buckett]

"Shocking stuff", "Shocking complacency", "Truly shocked" - there's a lot of shock on this thread!

I'm shocked at all this "faux outrage"

[AncientMariner]

All this religious sanctimony and snowflakes, really feels like Christmas now. 

[ymip]

Dark days these "banter" years...... 

[ictchris]

Imagine they'd had instagram and camera phones when Pele was our manager.

[davie]

I’m probably the most lapsed catholic that I know but I have to say that I find some of the responses in this thread crap beyond belief. I had thought, for years, that sectarianism was a problem that existed in the central belt and was largely absent here. I wonder how I got this so wrong, so:

“Oh dear, grown men on a night out using swear words. I won't be losing any sleep over it”.

So is a clear statement of sectarian hate acceptable? If it’s not acceptable to sing this in the middle of Glasgow on a Saturday night, it’s not acceptable anywhere. Using the expression “F**k the Pope” is, by definition, sectarian. If you said it at a football match, you would be prosecuted under the OFBA.

“It's not the smartest thing that has been done, but because it has been videos and published somewhere some drunken 'humour has been deemed to be sectarian. There's worse being said at play school”

This is wrong in its entirety. It is clearly sectarian and the very opposite is taught in schools.

The deleted post by “Gadgie Coff” was gone before I could screen grab it but it was stunningly poor to the extent that it was probably criminal in and of its self. There is a problem within the Catholic Church with inappropriate sexual behaviour but the assertions in that post were inaccurate and exaggerated. Those of you who saw it will make your own minds up about that.

“Racism is prejudice against people for what they are, and is many levels more serious than religious bigotry”

Wrong. Both are equally serious in the eyes of the Law and both have been at the root of untold misery- ask people in Northern Ireland. Bigotry is bigotry is bigotry.

“Yes it did go over my head, so why wouldn't the same draconian exercise be undertaken when someone blasphemes the name of God or Christ rather than the Pope? who after all is a mortal man masquerading as the Vicar of Christ on earth”

By all means hold your view but does that really have to demean others? Masquerading implies deceit through appearance. It’s not, it’s simply a different way of expressing faith to yours.

“No one is defending it, as Christians we are taught to love our neighbour of whatever belief , Romanist, Muslim, Buddist but the comments of  Bdu 98196 displays all the prejudices of the Roman inquisition. If no one accepts guilt you are all guilty, all must atone, no appeals. That said, why should anyone have respect to the Pope who has usurped the place of Christ. who says to followers of the Roman sect "come out of her my people that ye be not partakers of her sins and that ye receive not of her plagues" Rev18:4.Note: MY people. Roman Catholics are MY brethren and I have many RC friends whom I hope to convert to the true path before this life is done”.

By implication, you do not recognise Catholics as Christian and given the rest of your post I can understand why. The office of the inquisition was abolished in the 18^th Century and to be honest you simply use the kind of exceptionalist arguments that they would have used against you. I wouldn’t ask you to respect the Pope, I’d ask you to respect everyone. By the way, Christ said nothing about Catholicism. His death predated and informed it. You are chronologically wrong.

“Acceptance by fans of religious hate crimes -really ? Tad hysterical don't you think”

No, for the reasons stated above.

“I agree completely with that, but it sits at odds with your previous post. Irish Catholics are hated in Scotland, not because of their religious choices, but because they belong to or were descended from a large group of migrant 'others'. That's where the parallel with racism comes in”

Are Irish Catholics hated in Scotland? Not in my part of it. Your history is wrong. Scotland was a largely Catholic Country until the reformation in the 16^th Century. Only then did Protestantism become the dominant religion, got exported by Scots to Ulster and the rest is actual history.

I’m not a RC but I’m a Christian and I do understand that RCs may find the term FTP offensive but as Christians we have to turn the other cheek as Christ taught us. What annoys me is the faux outrage that goes on today as we live in a blame culture and there is always some do gooder wanting someone to be punished for minor issues. Maybe if we adopted what Jesus said when he caught a woman in adultery. He said to all the accusers who wanted her punished, He who is without sin cast the first stone. Maybe we should all think about this before we criticise”

 Punishment? No, all I want is people to see that this tripe is unacceptable. Full stop, so I’ll criticise.

Sorry about the length of this but all this thread has done is tell me that there is a broad stripe of low grade sectarianism voiced here at the football club I have supported for years, some of it by people I genuinely thought knew better. My kids were brought up Catholic and one of them now teaches in a Catholic school. I know that they would be raging if they read some of the stuff here. I am on their behalf.

If you want dramatics, this is my last post here. I won’t be back.

[RednBlackComeback]

https://nilbymouth.org/history/

[dougiedanger]

23 minutes ago, ictchris said:

Imagine they'd had instagram and camera phones when Pele was our manager.

Pele was a sound guy and would never have put up with this kind of sectarian bile creeping into the club.

[dougiedanger]

For those who think all this is just 'PC gone mad' etc., if you came out with this stuff 30/40 years ago you would have had a far stronger reaction and most likely a sore face for your troubles.

Being a sly racist/sectarian does not make you a man. Having played football back then, I never heard anything like this because men knew how to act and it would only be the weakest ones who would try anything like this. They would soon be put in their place.

Sadly, being a right-wing tw*t is now equated with being a man, but make no mistake this is a new thing, and shame on anyone who goes along with it.