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caleyboy

Who wants Gary Warren to stay?

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19 minutes ago, caleydawson said:

I'm not quite sure why everyone is losing their minds about this, he sat on the bench for most of the second half of the season and quite honestly our most successful part of our season, not just that but we currently have one of the lowest budgets in the league this season and his Gary being on the wages he is it would be stupid to keep him just to sit on the bench because "he brings experience" if he has been released he would legally have had to agree with it aswell so it's not as if he doesn't get a say in it and Robbo had already stated he would only have left once he found somewhere else to go otherwise he would have used him. This current board is having to make drastic changes financially due to the way the previous board ran things so if that means cutting down on the playing squad and letting our youth players play more and trying to push more things in terms of sponsorship i'm not sure how it is a bad thing it is a business after all. 

As I have highlighted before.  The accounts at the end of the last financial year showed a higher bank balance than was the case in the vast majority of previous years.  This whole "the previous board left the club in a financial mess" line has no basis in fact.  What's more, it is those previous board members (and associates) who provided the money to keep the wolves from the door last season.

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Really getting fed up with the blame culture. The last board couldn't do the job they were appointed to do and let a chairman run riot so they have done the right thing and resigned. The current chair has made many noises about this and thàt which is a dangerous thing to do. At some stage he will be held to account if he doesn't deliver. The problem we have is how long the club can survive on the funding it generates. Something has to give sometime unless we have people on board who can shake it all up and provide the answers. Not an easy task.

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Caleydawson - ICT will be 25 years old in Feb, not 1.  For 7 of those years Gary was at the club.  

Having one of lowest wage budgets in the league - wish we were Alloa?   They did a study in England to look at the correlations between wages paid and league position - it doesn’t play out very well usually.

Anyway, we can draw a line under the whole ‘Premiership wage situation’ as Tremarco signed a new deal as I guess Polworth never got one.

The board have cut the squad back to as far as it can - we have about 16 outfield players, a starting XI and a bench, supplemented by the young players.  But even that starting XI and bench is very young.  

So where now?  Nowhere left to cut!  On to new revenue generation .  Nobody at all wants to have players taking up space or a wage and the club spending more than it makes, all agree on that.  The main grievance is the club want to cut costs and use the fan as assets to increase matchday  expenditure.  That may work at Walmart but if all we can say about the club is we have the 4th highest wage bill (as it likely was before all this anyway) in the league it won’t keep people spending. After season ticket money is sunk, what then?

 ICT25 is being seen as a chance to get more money from fans, no supporter involvement on the already-in-place organising committee just ideas from Yvonne and Graham that all cost money.  This is what Kilmarnock did in 2000/1 and the fans reacted badly.  It is what the Old Firm do and rely on.  We don’t have that kind of resilient fan base.  

The cuts have happened and nowhere left to cut now.  So let’s see where the attention goes now...

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44 minutes ago, caleyboy said:

Really getting fed up with the blame culture. The last board couldn't do the job they were appointed to do and let a chairman run riot so they have done the right thing and resigned. The current chair has made many noises about this and thàt which is a dangerous thing to do. At some stage he will be held to account if he doesn't deliver. The problem we have is how long the club can survive on the funding it generates. Something has to give sometime unless we have people on board who can shake it all up and provide the answers. Not an easy task.

Not an easy task at all.  And it’s very easy to criticise - definitely agree.   I am supportive of Robbo, 100%.  The board on the other hand - I think they could do better - as it doesn’t take a season to decide on budgets or analyse a spreadsheet.  If Mr Rae wants to say a lot then he will have to deliver a lot.  Nothing I have been asking for wasn’t promised.  We have a CEO we have never engaged with since her start in November and a board that said a huge amount about winning back trust and valuing fans.  The last direct communique, I believe, was to berate us actually after the cup final.  Justified or not that was three months ago.

The board and CEO don’t get a free pass - they are accountable.  Did they need to cut - yes.  Could that have been done by the town accountants?  Yes.  

Edited by Glover
Clarification
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1 hour ago, Glover said:

Caleydawson - ICT will be 25 years old in Feb, not 1.  For 7 of those years Gary was at the club.  

Having one of lowest wage budgets in the league - wish we were Alloa?   They did a study in England to look at the correlations between wages paid and league position - it doesn’t play out very well usually.

Anyway, we can draw a line under the whole ‘Premiership wage situation’ as Tremarco signed a new deal as I guess Polworth never got one.

The board have cut the squad back to as far as it can - we have about 16 outfield players, a starting XI and a bench, supplemented by the young players.  But even that starting XI and bench is very young.  

So where now?  Nowhere left to cut!  On to new revenue generation .  Nobody at all wants to have players taking up space or a wage and the club spending more than it makes, all agree on that.  The main grievance is the club want to cut costs and use the fan as assets to increase matchday  expenditure.  That may work at Walmart but if all we can say about the club is we have the 4th highest wage bill (as it likely was before all this anyway) in the league it won’t keep people spending. After season ticket money is sunk, what then?

 ICT25 is being seen as a chance to get more money from fans, no supporter involvement on the already-in-place organising committee just ideas from Yvonne and Graham that all cost money.  This is what Kilmarnock did in 2000/1 and the fans reacted badly.  It is what the Old Firm do and rely on.  We don’t have that kind of resilient fan base.  

The cuts have happened and nowhere left to cut now.  So let’s see where the attention goes now...

I just find that depressing! There are loads of fans at club who were around pre merger who would have been happy to get involved. Why do we always get the basics so wrong? 

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9 hours ago, caleydawson said:

I'm not quite sure why everyone is losing their minds about this, he sat on the bench for most of the second half of the season and quite honestly our most successful part of our season

:laugh:

Warren played almost 20 games in the second half of the season so actually he featured heavily during our most successful run of form. He only played 8 games in the first part of the season. But feel free to continue making stuff up.

Edited by RiG
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2 hours ago, old caley girl said:

I just find that depressing! There are loads of fans at club who were around pre merger who would have been happy to get involved. Why do we always get the basics so wrong? 

Many.  I went to Caledonian pre-season games in the summer holidays when I was in high school.  I’m definitely not no.1 fan though - from a PH postcode and I moved to Glasgow then lived abroad (and kind of still do).  I flew over for the board meeting because I am convinced the board are there not only to ensure compliance but also to grow and develop the club in the community and improve fan experience and not always for money upfront - the Chairmen of Dunfermline, Falkirk, Partick know that.

ICT25 is a case in point but if the fans are seen only as a resource to be exploited then I would argue that we need to communicate that that is not ok and is not sustainable.  Supporters are shareholders, supporters are stakeholders.

Its a thread about Gary, so the point made above is good.  Be nice if  we could do something to say bye from fans - Fisher appreciated the fans at the end of that season for wishing him well (on the pitch - telling off material) and it mitigated his negative feelings a lot.  Maybe we could discuss how to do something at whichever club he finds.  

 

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1 hour ago, Glover said:

Be nice if  we could do something to say bye from fans - Fisher appreciated the fans at the end of that season for wishing him well (on the pitch - telling off material) and it mitigated his negative feelings a lot.  Maybe we could discuss how to do something at whichever club he finds. 

I appreciate that it's very early days for the new-look CJT, but maybe you could organise something to be presented to him at his first game at his new club, since we never had a chance to say goodbye.  Maybe a memento of the Highlands, rather than of ICT itself.

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21 minutes ago, snorbens_caleyman said:

I appreciate that it's very early days for the new-look CJT, but maybe you could organise something to be presented to him at his first game at his new club, since we never had a chance to say goodbye.  Maybe a memento of the Highlands, rather than of ICT itself.

Certainly doable, and I will get back to you on that as soon as I consult the group as a whole and have some tangibles to feed back.  If you or anyone has ideas I can put that forward too.  Thank you for your suggestion.

Edited by Glover
open to suggestions

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Lets hope it;

35 minutes ago, snorbens_caleyman said:

I appreciate that it's very early days for the new-look CJT, but maybe you could organise something to be presented to him at his first game at his new club, since we never had a chance to say goodbye.  Maybe a memento of the Highlands, rather than of ICT itself.

Lets hope it's not County then...

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Gary Warren was and continues to be a gentleman who will be missed when he departs. There is, as yet, no definitive statement that this has occurred (except from the P&J, who with the greatest of respect have occasionally got things wrong or reported prematurely in the past) and a load of twitter comment.

Gary was an excellent club captain who embraced the Highlands when he moved up here and that’s not always an easy thing to do. I remember him being the man to visit John Horne in Hospital after his stroke and John tells me he greeted him by name at every game he saw him at after that. That kind of behaviour counts. Even after the heaviest of defeats and at times when no other player could or would speak to the press he would be the one who stepped forward. This was a guy who was genuinely interested in what people who were associated with ICTFC thought and did. Every mascot who met him last year was left with the impression of a man who was genuinely pleased to meet them. On the pitch he was an absolute warrior, the kind of defender who could be relied upon to win his personal battles all over the pitch. In no small measure he was responsible for making Josh Meekings the player he was, allowing him the footballing role whilst he did the defending. My only disappointment is for the man, not because of him. If anyone deserved that Scottish Cup final and a winner’s medal it was him and yet he celebrated for his team like a madman despite not playing that day. Look at the booking that ruled him out – defending.

On a personal level I will miss the big man. Always positive, always had time for you. I hope that, if the story about Yeovil is true, he enjoys his time there despite being a gashead.  He deserves it.

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1 hour ago, davie said:

Gary Warren was and continues to be a gentleman who will be missed when he departs. There is, as yet, no definitive statement that this has occurred (except from the P&J, who with the greatest of respect have occasionally got things wrong or reported prematurely in the past) and a load of twitter comment.

 

Gary was an excellent club captain who embraced the Highlands when he moved up here and that’s not always an easy thing to do. I remember him being the man to visit John Horne in Hospital after his stroke and John tells me he greeted him by name at every game he saw him at after that. That kind of behaviour counts. Even after the heaviest of defeats and at times when no other player could or would speak to the press he would be the one who stepped forward. This was a guy who was genuinely interested in what people who were associated with ICTFC thought and did. Every mascot who met him last year was left with the impression of a man who was genuinely pleased to meet them. On the pitch he was an absolute warrior, the kind of defender who could be relied upon to win his personal battles all over the pitch. In no small measure he was responsible for making Josh Meekings the player he was, allowing him the footballing role whilst he did the defending. My only disappointment is for the man, not because of him. If anyone deserved that Scottish Cup final and a winner’s medal it was him and yet he celebrated for his team like a madman despite not playing that day. Look at the booking that ruled him out – defending.

 

On a personal level I will miss the big man. Always positive, always had time for you. I hope that, if the story about Yeovil is true, he enjoys his time there despite being a gashead.  He deserves it.

 

Statement now out 

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That statement reads like it was written by someone who failed Standard Grade English with made-up quotes and the tweet reads like it was written by a robot.

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Some posters getting a bit carried away on this topic IMO. Gary Warren was a great centre half in his day, one of the best we've seen, but he's never reached the same heights since his injury, and wasn't getting any faster. It doesn't make sense for us to have high earners sitting on the bench, nor does it make sense for Warren to waste one of the remaining seasons of his playing career sitting on the bench. He's had a good run playing for ICT, and with his CV, will easily walk into a well paying coaching or management job when he chooses to. (Degree educated, professional teacher, former captain of England Universities, Scottish Cup winning Captain, England Captain and Hall of Famer Terry Butcher as a reference etc).

Rather than dwell on minutia of contract arrangements, public statements, and the like - we'd be better served focusing on the big picture. Warren is almost certainly moving on to a lucrative career in coaching  - and we have 3 talented young centre halves on our books ready to step up to the plate. When one door closes, another opens!

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47 minutes ago, AlexJones said:

Some posters getting a bit carried away on this topic IMO. Gary Warren was a great centre half in his day, one of the best we've seen, but he's never reached the same heights since his injury, and wasn't getting any faster. It doesn't make sense for us to have high earners sitting on the bench, nor does it make sense for Warren to waste one of the remaining seasons of his playing career sitting on the bench. He's had a good run playing for ICT, and with his CV, will easily walk into a well paying coaching or management job when he chooses to. (Degree educated, professional teacher, former captain of England Universities, Scottish Cup winning Captain, England Captain and Hall of Famer Terry Butcher as a reference etc).

Rather than dwell on minutia of contract arrangements, public statements, and the like - we'd be better served focusing on the big picture. Warren is almost certainly moving on to a lucrative career in coaching  - and we have 3 talented young centre halves on our books ready to step up to the plate. When one door closes, another opens!

Some posters getting a bit carried away on this topic IMO:    If it was Elsdon or Fisher I'd agree.

with his CV, will easily walk into a well paying coaching or management job...Warren is almost certainly moving on to a lucrative career in coaching:  nothing is as conclusive as that in football or in any job these days.  A lot of players get their first shot at the club they were playing for when their career ended.  If his CV is that good we have made a monumental error, since we have no asst. manager. 

Rather than dwell on minutia of contract arrangements, public statements, and the like:   that is absolutely fine, the board will love that sentiment and would no doubt be happy for fans to limit their interaction to season ticket, shirt, pie, 90 mins, off home.  'Good governance' as a term includes transparency to stakeholders - so by the Chairman's own words at the AGM, fans should be ensuring transparency and that includes dwelling on contract arrangements and timely statements.   Also, don't get me started on Dundee Utd's provision for fans - check out their website if you think I'm overreaching here.

Fan involvement in clubs is a good thing for all!  The Scottish government has been trying to increase it - why would you want to limit it?

 

Edited by Glover
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1 hour ago, AlexJones said:

Some posters getting a bit carried away on this topic IMO. Gary Warren was a great centre half in his day, one of the best we've seen, but he's never reached the same heights since his injury, and wasn't getting any faster. It doesn't make sense for us to have high earners sitting on the bench, nor does it make sense for Warren to waste one of the remaining seasons of his playing career sitting on the bench. He's had a good run playing for ICT, and with his CV, will easily walk into a well paying coaching or management job when he chooses to. (Degree educated, professional teacher, former captain of England Universities, Scottish Cup winning Captain, England Captain and Hall of Famer Terry Butcher as a reference etc).

Rather than dwell on minutia of contract arrangements, public statements, and the like - we'd be better served focusing on the big picture. Warren is almost certainly moving on to a lucrative career in coaching  - and we have 3 talented young centre halves on our books ready to step up to the plate. When one door closes, another opens!

He had a year left on his contract so to be told he is not wanted and to find another club by people who know absolutely nothing about football is beyond belief.

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One thing we were promised was better communication. We are short of money but that costs little and, had it been delivered would have been much appreciated by fans.

However, rather than improving, communication is almost non existent and that apology of a statement released today takes the biscuit.Quite apart from the fact that it is belated, it is an embarrassment and looks like it's been written by a fifteen year old on work experience and a thoroughly inarticulate fifteen year old at that. Just what is our recently appointed CEO doing to justify her salary ?

Edited by Kingsmills
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1 hour ago, caleyboy said:

He had a year left on his contract so to be told he is not wanted and to find another club by people who know absolutely nothing about football is beyond belief.

What if it was John Robertson that told him?

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In terms of moving on, is there any support for a new post where people on this forum can formally thank Gary for his enormous personal contribution to the club. We have not had a chance to say good bye to a tremendous player so this might be the best way some of us can can say thanks for the memories.

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33 minutes ago, caley100 said:

What if it was John Robertson that told him?

Oh come on. Of course it was JR that told him but he was obviously instructed to.

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13 hours ago, AlexJones said:

Rather than dwell on minutia of contract arrangements, public statements, and the like - we'd be better served focusing on the big picture. Warren is almost certainly moving on to a lucrative career in coaching  - and we have 3 talented young centre halves on our books ready to step up to the plate. When one door closes, another opens!

Erm, that's sort of the major issue that is irking the fans. Yet again we find the club letting themselves down when it comes to contracts and dealing with players. After the way things went last summer with Meekings and Shearer you'd think it couldn't sink any lower and yet it did.

There is a continuing issue at ICT with how player issues are handled coupled with rank amateur statements that make the club look like they are at a level below juniors. It's happening time and time again and fans are sick of it. Given that we are allegedly paying people to improve our social media output and this is the drivel we're getting we've every right to voice concerns.

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