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Laurence

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Where there's the will!!!!

After all, let's not forget that TeamGB themselves are punching way above their weight on the medal count...especially if you are comparing likelihood of success on population of the nation competing.

Acceptance of all competitors and competing countries regardless of race, religion, location, size, politics, wealth etc.....are these not the principles that underpin the entire concept of the Olympic Games? Surely if there's anywhere, or any event, where a country should be allowed to stand alone and on it's own merits and not have it's resources (especially when they are, as you claim, limited) ripped off to support those of another....then it's the Olympics.

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The cash would come from us not sending it south to pay for things like the "LONDON" Olympics and the legacy which will be left for "English Sport"....to the tune of £135 Million for grassroots sports, not a penny of which will come north.

SportScotland spent £6 Million investing in facilities on the promise of being allocated training camps....they got two teams who brought less than 30 athletes to camps in Scotland. More than £200,000 per (foreign) athlete!!!

Tens of millions of regeneration funding redirected from Scotland to the London boroughs around the Olympic Park area.

£150 million of Scottish Lottery Funding redirected to London.

To top it all off, economists reckon that Scotland saw a sizeable dip in tourism as people either went to London or avoided the UK altogether.

And that's just off the top of my head.

Compare that to the Commonwealth Games where Scotland will receive a grand total of "ZERO" funding from the UK Government and a legacy programme valued at less than £7 Million over 5 years.

To answer your question....Scotland would get the money from where it gets it at the moment, the only difference being that they retain it for themselves.

Out of 5 million or so people living in Scotland, I would guess only about two million of them pay Income Tax

Several of those 2 million get their pay from England and are taxed by English Tax offices

Like I did when I lived in France, I paid my tax to the UK

Therefore I don't think Scotland will be wealthy after Independance

For a few years the oil fields will help, but they are over the best now, incidently most of the oil production is financed by American money, so only the tax on the oil goes to government.

When the oil money dries up Scotland may find themseves financially strethched as is now the case in a former UK country of Ireland.

The Irish are being dictated to by the EEC, and are suffering, and in the Euro.

There is no guarantee that the Bank of England will support a Scottish pound after independance, why should they ?

This would force Scotland into the Euro and they wuld become a pawn of the Central bank of Europe under German control

There is also the problem of Scotland's banks , not being in a healthy state. How can an independant country exist without a stand alone bank.

We might moan about Whitehall but it is far better than Berlin

Sorry to digress , but to complaining about funding of Sport in Scotland brought it on.

Incidently how do you think the Commonwealth games in Glasgow will be funded. A good deal I think by the British tax payer that's for sure.

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Where there's the will!!!!

After all, let's not forget that TeamGB themselves are punching way above their weight on the medal count...especially if you are comparing likelihood of success on population of the nation competing.

Acceptance of all competitors and competing countries regardless of race, religion, location, size, politics, wealth etc.....are these not the principles that underpin the entire concept of the Olympic Games? Surely if there's anywhere, or any event, where a country should be allowed to stand alone and on it's own merits and not have it's resources (especially when they are, as you claim, limited) ripped off to support those of another....then it's the Olympics.

Where there's the will!!!!

After all, let's not forget that TeamGB themselves are punching way above their weight on the medal count...especially if you are comparing likelihood of success on population of the nation competing.

Acceptance of all competitors and competing countries regardless of race, religion, location, size, politics, wealth etc.....are these not the principles that underpin the entire concept of the Olympic Games? Surely if there's anywhere, or any event, where a country should be allowed to stand alone and on it's own merits and not have it's resources (especially when they are, as you claim, limited) ripped off to support those of another....then it's the Olympics.

The problem is I don't think there is the will...as the vote for independence will prove

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Sorry Laurence but you are wrong on many counts and possibly blinded by the anti independence propoganda. Oil of the Scottish coasts will not run out in the next 100 years. The north sea has quite a few new developments coming onstream now and there are still many untapped areas. The west of Shetland and Atlantic developments are being progressed and there's a lot to be found in those deep water regions. Regions that are only coming to the fore now as deep water drilling technology changes. Scotland is also at the forefront in research and development of a number of renewable energy projects. There is a lot of tax revenue from oil for a lot of years to come. There are also many thousands employed in the industry who are high end tax payers and who spend their money in Scotland.

Which brings me to your point on income tax. At the moment everyone in UK who pays tax pays it to a central fund regardless of which office handles their accounts. In an independent environment they would pay their taxes in the country they resided in.

Why would the Bank of England need to support a Scottish pound? Scotland still gaurantee's its currency in sterling silver. The pound would remain though and it would be supported by England for one very simple reason. The majority of trade in Britian crosses the border of Scotland and England in both directions. One of our biggest foriegn exports is whiskey. To produce it we import a lot of our barley from south of the border. There are many other examples of cross border trade and many billions of pounds worth so yes the Scottish pound will be as important to England as the English one will be to the Scots.

Bottom line is England dont want the breakaway because they know we will be very wealthy while they lose wealth. As for the banks, perhaps if you take your rose coloured specs of you'd see that many banks are having problems, including English ones.

Oh and the Commonwealth games will be paid for from the Scottish government. Lottery monies. Broadcasting rights. City of Glasgow and the sell on of the many properties being built in the east end of Glasgow and they wont go vastly over budget as in the case of Londons Olympics.

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You have to be from across the border to see independance for the rubbish it is

Independance for Scotland will cost my business in the region of £100 a week

Too many Scots are fighting medieval battles and are not interested in anything but history.

I hear lots of how the present SNP lot will rule Scotland better than their rivals, but Indepenence is for ever, How can Scotland vote the future of Scotland down the drain for a quick fix present day politics.. Remember too there are over 800 thousand Scots living in England who will be living in a foreign land after Independence.

Vote out of the Union and it is PERMANENT, not like a general election when you can change your rulers in 4 or 5 years. You are stuck with it for hundreds of years.

Anyway I apologise for getting off topic, This is about the olympics , it wasn't me who introduced funding for sport, in a very anti-English manner.

I have been pleased to see the Union Flag shown at this Olympics, remember a lot of Scots died for that flag over two world wars.

I don't want this to be the last team GB. Or the last time we see the Union flag at the Olympics

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Oh and the Commonwealth games will be paid for from the Scottish government. Lottery monies. Broadcasting rights. City of Glasgow and the sell on of the many properties being built in the east end of Glasgow and they wont go vastly over budget as in the case of Londons Olympics.

You mean "Glasgow's" Commonwealth Games - which they will be to us in the Highlands just as much as the current celebrations are "London's" to the separatist faction, who must now be blubbering into their whisky at the current success of Team GB and the national pride which that is generating.

Please remember that a lot of objections which the Scottish separatists come up with regarding rule from London apply at least as much to us in the Highlands with respect to rule from Edinburgh - which a Yes vote in 2014 would endorse.

More so, perhaps, given the current Holyrood trend to focus power in the central belt - ie on themselves - for instance by creating single Police and Fire and Rescue services and trying to buy "yes" votes by ordering a Council Tax freeze - hence depriving local councils of a lot of freedom of operation and concentrating even more power in Edinburgh.

But to return to a sporting theme - I can't think of a more overstaffed and inefficient quango than Sportscotland!

PS - as I write, Hoy has just won that magnificent sixth gold medal! But this is a total which he would never have reached if he had had to rely on back up from members of Team Scolympia rather than Team GB in team events - a fact which I understand the great man himself is more than willing to acknowledge, along with the importance of the training facilities and partners he has had in England.

I have a strange suspicion that should the worst come to the worst, a lot of potential Scolympians would suddenly unearth English grannies :lol:

Edited by Charles Bannerman

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What a goal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Will live long in the memory - Everybody at my fire station cheered that one .

In the Munich world cup I think, When England failed to qualify

If we had a proper Great Britain football team, I mean a proper one, Qualification would be a sinch

The Rugby lot have the British Lions which seems to work?

The Davis cup in Tennis as well

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So much for the Bannerman Clan Motto "Pro Patria"....your ancestors will be turning in their graves!!!

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What a lot of drivel on this thread. The fact is that team GB has already won 22 gold medals and there are more to come. Team GB has got more golds than in any Olympics since 1908 and clearly far more nations compete these days. It is safe to say this is the best performance ever and we should celebrate that. It is a British team comprising of individuals from all corners of the UK, some as individuals and some as members of teams. Some are Scottish, some Welsh, some Irish and some English. Some of the Scots live in England and some of the English live in Scotland. Some of the Scots have English parents and some of the English have Scottish parents. The support teams consist of a similar eclectic mixes of the UK's constituent citizens. This is a UK team and it seems pointless to think of Scottish medals or English medals or to conjecture how a Scottish team representing an independent Scotland might fare in the future.

What I can say with some certainty is that those wishing an independent Scotland should be celebrating the success of team GB because it represents success for Scotland as a part of the United Kingdom. The success will hopefully spur youngsters from all parts of the UK to take up sport. As a result, success for Scotland as an independent nation in any future games will be more likely because of the legacy of team GB.

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Yeah, they're doing so much to inspire Scottish Youngsters that all the free tickets given to schools went to schools based in England only. It's things like that which get on my goat....all this talk of a "United Games, doing good for the whole country".....it's a crock of chit.

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What a lot of drivel on this thread. The fact is that team GB has already won 22 gold medals and there are more to come. Team GB has got more golds than in any Olympics since 1908 and clearly far more nations compete these days. It is safe to say this is the best performance ever and we should celebrate that. It is a British team comprising of individuals from all corners of the UK, some as individuals and some as members of teams. Some are Scottish, some Welsh, some Irish and some English. Some of the Scots live in England and some of the English live in Scotland. Some of the Scots have English parents and some of the English have Scottish parents. The support teams consist of a similar eclectic mixes of the UK's constituent citizens. This is a UK team and it seems pointless to think of Scottish medals or English medals or to conjecture how a Scottish team representing an independent Scotland might fare in the future.

What I can say with some certainty is that those wishing an independent Scotland should be celebrating the success of team GB because it represents success for Scotland as a part of the United Kingdom. The success will hopefully spur youngsters from all parts of the UK to take up sport. As a result, success for Scotland as an independent nation in any future games will be more likely because of the legacy of team GB.

:thumbup::cheer01::twothumbsup::clapoverhead:

Unfortunately this thread took on a Separatist dimension round about post #6, to which it has been necessary for a number of posters to respond.

Before suggesting that the thread should return to its original theme of gold medals for Team GB, I would only want to point out on the motto theme that I am very pleased to be a member of the increasing majority north of the Solway - Tweed line for whom "Patria" = "Britannica".

But to return to the Olympics - maybe we should mark Team GB's stunning success by adopting a motto for that as well.

How about something like "Better Together" maybe? :lol:

Edited by Charles Bannerman

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What a lot of drivel on this thread. The fact is that team GB has already won 22 gold medals and there are more to come. Team GB has got more golds than in any Olympics since 1908 and clearly far more nations compete these days. It is safe to say this is the best performance ever and we should celebrate that. It is a British team comprising of individuals from all corners of the UK, some as individuals and some as members of teams. Some are Scottish, some Welsh, some Irish and some English. Some of the Scots live in England and some of the English live in Scotland. Some of the Scots have English parents and some of the English have Scottish parents. The support teams consist of a similar eclectic mixes of the UK's constituent citizens. This is a UK team and it seems pointless to think of Scottish medals or English medals or to conjecture how a Scottish team representing an independent Scotland might fare in the future.

What I can say with some certainty is that those wishing an independent Scotland should be celebrating the success of team GB because it represents success for Scotland as a part of the United Kingdom. The success will hopefully spur youngsters from all parts of the UK to take up sport. As a result, success for Scotland as an independent nation in any future games will be more likely because of the legacy of team GB.

:thumbup::cheer01::twothumbsup::clapoverhead:

Unfortunately this thread took on a Separatist * dimension round about post #6, to which it has been necessary for a number of posters to respond.

Before suggesting that the thread should return to its original theme of gold medals for Team GB, I would only want to point out on the motto theme that I am very pleased to be a member of the increasing majority north of the Solway - Tweed line for whom "Patria" = "Britannica".

But to return to the Olympics - maybe we should mark Team GB's stunning success by adopting a motto for that as well.

How about something like "Better Together" maybe? :lol:

*Independence

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Scolympians at this Team GB thing in Englandshire have contributed into double figures of the gold medals. Funny how sport breaks down barriers, a lot of the sports people who train in England also represent other nations. Why do we seem to think that this would change if we seperate from the union. Will we chuck out all the "foreigners" that we have here in Scotland - I think not, and if they are born in Scotland the majority would represent Scotland. Think people completely underestimate what passion people have in being Scottish, as I rarely hear anyone Scottish who will ever call themselves British, unless they go to Castle Greyskull with the other Orcs.

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Scolympians at this Team GB thing in Englandshire have contributed into double figures of the gold medals. Funny how sport breaks down barriers, a lot of the sports people who train in England also represent other nations. Why do we seem to think that this would change if we seperate from the union. Will we chuck out all the "foreigners" that we have here in Scotland - I think not, and if they are born in Scotland the majority would represent Scotland. Think people completely underestimate what passion people have in being Scottish, as I rarely hear anyone Scottish who will ever call themselves British, unless they go to Castle Greyskull with the other Orcs.

The Parish Pump syndrome will never die!

Why is the little man always starts the bother, in the school yard or in the pub, the big guy just smiles.

Think about it ?

By The way I am told the correct terminology is not Independence but as defined by dictionary

Secession (derived from the Latin term secessio) is the act of withdrawing from an organization, union, or especially a political entity. Threats of secession also can be a strategy for achieving more limited goals

When the South tried to leave the USA they were known as secessionists

also the Irish leaving the Union was known as secession also Northern Irland leaving the Free state after only one day was also called that too.

Edited by Laurence

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Getting back to the Olympics, its kind of surprising that Team GB is relatively poor in shooting events. Can we not draw upon the vast expertise in our armed forces? Or police marksmen?

Or failing that, there are plenty of Londoners who are a bit handy with a shooter - but perhaps they've already got enough gold around their necks.

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Or failing that, there are plenty of Londoners who are a bit handy with a shooter - but perhaps they've already got enough gold around their necks.

:lol: Yeh mayte.... 'aindy wiv the old shooo'ah! Get the old Ruud Gullit to hit the Joe Cool on the Princess Margaret!

By the way, did the Opening Ceremony feature dancing chimney sweeps?

I hadn't actually been aware that shooting hadn't been been going so well for Team GB. I suppose there's always the danger that something will give way somewhere or not quite come up to the mark. On that subject, the entire Austrialian nation seems to have been struggling this time round. It used to be the case that the Aussies were so good at so much that the whole world used to pinch their coaches. Maybe they have none left!

I had to laugh yesterday when Team Oz eventually did come good and Anna Mears beat Victoria Pendleton in the women's cycle sprint final (albeit after a controversial demotion in the opening ride). The Australian coach embraces Mears in front of an open mic with the immortal words (I won't try to do the Crocodile Dundee accent phonetically):-

"I am SO f***ing proud of YOU".

About a billion people must have been thoroughly entertained.

Edited by Charles Bannerman

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So she should be f***ing proud, she just beat Vicky Pendleton.

The Team GB athlete who didnt qualify for some track event was heard going F..k S..t f..k s..t f..k s..t about ten times and then repeated it as he past the qualifier being interviewed as well.

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Charles I was told after the firearms ban all the British gun clubs were closed down ( Including the one in the House of Commons)

The shooters I am also told now train in France

I think we did get a medal in the Clay shooting ( called traps or similar) catogory but I'am not sure.

Not sure again if the Northern Ireland guys could train over the border. added without comment.

Mind you I believe game hunting wild deer) is a National Sport in Scotland So somebody up here should be able to shoot

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I think we did get a medal in the Clay shooting ( called traps or similar) catogory but I'am not sure.

I think you are right there. Double trap possibly.

At the Paris Games in 1900 they used real pigeons!

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Not sure again if the Northern Ireland guys could train over the border.

Well if burkas are allowed, why not balaclavas?!

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Not sure again if the Northern Ireland guys could train over the border.

Well if burkas are allowed, why not balaclavas?!

Fantastic I knew somebody would find a suitable response - superp

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Getting back to the Olympics, its kind of surprising that Team GB is relatively poor in shooting events. Can we not draw upon the vast expertise in our armed forces? Or police marksmen?

Or failing that, there are plenty of Londoners who are a bit handy with a shooter - but perhaps they've already got enough gold around their necks.

You'd think the Americans would be quite good at that. :shooting: :ninja:

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Shooting was once a very successful sport in UK. Even in Scotland there were many gun clubs. Sadly, following the Dunblane massacre, and the very extreme laws that came about about owning and keeping weapons and ammunition many of the shooters and clubs gave up. The cost of security alone became too much. That coupled with the police having the power to check your guns at any time of day or night destroyed what was a very enjoyable sport. I had air rifles and shotguns since I was twelve and I loved the sport but became one of those totally disheartened by the over the top outcry to a madman. It was easier just to give up than argue the case that no amount of legislation will prevent a madman carrying out atrocities.

Even now people try and keep the sport low key. The young lad Robert Wilson who got Britians only medal, gold in the double trap event, had barely more than a mention in the press.

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