Tickets for Celtic Match

[billyshears]

Falkirk have managed to handle it no problem whatsoever with no loss of revenue.

Falkirk may not have lost revenue, but they would have had to fork out for the dozens of man-hours involved in the system they put in place.

Given the most recent financial results, did we really expect the club to absorb the cost of this surcharge. I'm certain that they would have been more than happy to add the entire cost to the away end tickets but SPL rules forbid it (the same SPL who stood by and allowed this surcharge to be put in place - if anyone has the power to do something about it, its them).

As has been pointed out by 5th Stand it is all about supply and demand, the club would be insane not to have a considerably higher price for games that attract almost double the fans that a normal home game does - remember the last Rangers game was a sell-out. In fact most economists would argue that the OF ticket prices are too low!

It is disappointing to see "fans" of the club encouraging others to stay away from games, particularly as your protest would be in vain. Some part time "supporter" would be sitting in your seat watching in awe at how the Celtic players are smaller in real life than they look on the telly, and realising that they are massively overpaid as our lads who are on 1/10 of their wages get stuck in!

[billyshears]

Have voted with my feet, very rarely go to the home games since last season when I gave up my season ticket. As have a lot of people when you see the crowd figures these days but the club still don't seem to care!

Yeah, I'm sure the club don't care that season ticket and matchday revenues are decreasing. Fatuous comments like that will undermine any valid arguments you might have.

[RiG]

Falkirk may not have lost revenue, but they would have had to fork out for the dozens of man-hours involved in the system they put in place.

Hardly. Falkirk off the field seem to be a well organised bunch. Their procedure was simple. A coupon was included int he Falkirk Herald inviting Rangers fans to complete it and mail it to the club and receive up to 4 tickets per coupon. Any left unsold through this venture were then sold via the Falkirk ticket office for about 3 days. No extra staff were employed and no extra hours were put in. These were all done by the regular staff in their usual work day. Rangers fans all got their tickets in plenty of time and, as far as I know, the Away section was sold out. Why can't ICT do something like this?

Given the most recent financial results, did we really expect the club to absorb the cost of this surcharge. I'm certain that they would have been more than happy to add the entire cost to the away end tickets but SPL rules forbid it (the same SPL who stood by and allowed this surcharge to be put in place - if anyone has the power to do something about it, its them).

Aberdeen absorbed the extra charge into the tickets for Home and Away fans and then offered Home fans purchasing these tickets a money off voucher for the next, or a future, Home game. Will ICT do something similar to compensate their fans?

As has been pointed out by 5th Stand it is all about supply and demand, the club would be insane not to have a considerably higher price for games that attract almost double the fans that a normal home game does - remember the last Rangers game was a sell-out. In fact most economists would argue that the OF ticket prices are too low!

There is only so long the club can milk the fans of their money. It would seem obvious that season tickets are down on last season, Saturdays attendance was 10% lower than previous fixtures against the Buddies. It's quite sad that the club would appear to view the Home fans simply as numbers and ? signs instead of what they actually are - followers of the team.

[billyshears]

There is only so long the club can milk the fans of their money. It would seem obvious that season tickets are down on last season, Saturdays attendance was 10% lower than previous fixtures against the Buddies. It's quite sad that the club would appear to view the Home fans simply as numbers and ? signs instead of what they actually are - followers of the team.

I can't understand why you would use an emotive phrase like "milk the fans of their money". Nobody is compelled to go to a football match, the prices are set and it is up to the public to determine whether the price is a fair exchange for the entertainment on offer. The board and senior management have a responsibility to maximise revenue at any opportunity and if that means taking advantage of the fact that OF games have a considerably bigger appeal than the other 15 or so, they should not be criticised for it.

Also the downturn in attendances and season tickets is likely to be largely down to the dreaded Credit Crunch. When money is tight, football is surely one of the first things that most are going to have to sacrifice (especially for families). Maybe we should lobby Gordon Brown - forget this energy efficiency rubbish, give the people what they want, free season tickets for your local club!

[L_G]

There is only so long the club can milk the fans of their money. It would seem obvious that season tickets are down on last season, Saturdays attendance was 10% lower than previous fixtures against the Buddies. It's quite sad that the club would appear to view the Home fans simply as numbers and ? signs instead of what they actually are - followers of the team.

I can't understand why you would use an emotive phrase like "milk the fans of their money". Nobody is compelled to go to a football match, the prices are set and it is up to the public to determine whether the price is a fair exchange for the entertainment on offer. The board and senior management have a responsibility to maximise revenue at any opportunity and if that means taking advantage of the fact that OF games have a considerably bigger appeal than the other 15 or so, they should not be criticised for it.

Also the downturn in attendances and season tickets is likely to be largely down to the dreaded Credit Crunch. When money is tight, football is surely one of the first things that most are going to have to sacrifice (especially for families). Maybe we should lobby Gordon Brown - forget this energy efficiency rubbish, give the people what they want, free season tickets for your local club!

An extra ?4 per ticket is a bit OTT, bearing in mind this game is in the middle of the school holidays and live on tele with an early kick off. I don't think this will be a sell out game. An average family would have to find an extra ?16 just to get through the gate. If I didn't have a season ticket I would be staying home to watch it on the tele.

[Jay_7]

Also the downturn in attendances and season tickets is likely to be largely down to the dreaded Credit Crunch.

In your opinion. I did not renew my season ticket this season and it wasn't for financial reasons.

The BoD should be ashamed of themselves but I fear they are likely to be smug with ?'s in their eyes. I await those who blindly defend the clubs decision...

Edited September 15, 2008 by Jay_7

[RiG]

I can't understand why you would use an emotive phrase like "milk the fans of their money". Nobody is compelled to go to a football match, the prices are set and it is up to the public to determine whether the price is a fair exchange for the entertainment on offer. The board and senior management have a responsibility to maximise revenue at any opportunity and if that means taking advantage of the fact that OF games have a considerably bigger appeal than the other 15 or so, they should not be criticised for it.

And it would appear to be that the Inverness public are deciding that it isn't a fair exchange with the recent attendances against Hibs and St. Mirren well down on previous seasons. Do you think that a family of four paying ?106 for the game against Celtic or Rangers is getting value for money? A ?4 increase is, as LG says, over the top.

Your admirable defence of the club is commendable. You should be their PR officer.

[CaleyD]

Do the maths.....

The 5% Levy means ICT having to pay Celtic somewhere in the region of ?3300 based on a ?24 ticket price (assuming all ticket sales were adult).

Allowing for the fact that we already charge an extra ?2 for OF games the the other ?2 is to cover this "levy".

A sell out crowd would net the club an extra ?8000 or so with the increased prices (4000 ticket sales assumed, which makes allowance for season ticket holders/freebie corporate tickets).

After payment of the Levy the club have made a ?4700 gain under the guise of increasing tickets to cover the cost of the levy.

So if your of a mind that we'll have a capacity crowd regardless, then you have to accept that the club are profiteering from it's own fans off the back of this OF levy.

If like me, you think that the crowd will be effected, then even if the away end is full (netting an extra ?5400ish) then it only takes a drop of around 90 people in the home end before the club start eroding the benefit of the increased prices....a drop of 225 or more and they are in to total loss and negative impact (i.e. being worse off than they would have been absorbing the cost without an increased ticket price).

IMO, it would have been better for the club to take the financial hit than to increase prices...and even better still if they had told the OF to do one and sold tickets themselves. It wasn't going to cost them anything like ?3300 to administer it at TCS, and they could have justifiably added a handling fee for away fans (as they do to home fans) for online & telephone sales, in order to recoup the cost.

[Scotty]

Forget about bodies through the door or break even numbers or any of the rest of that guff, the simple math is that the prices for 'A' games have been bumped by way more than 5% needed to cover the Celtic and Rangers levy.

Adult Main Stand: ?27 -> ?29 +7.41%

Adult North Stand: ?22 -> ?24 +9.09%

Adult Family Enclosure: ?17 -> ?19 +11.76%

Concession Main Stand: ?22 -> ?24 +9.09%

Concession North Stand: ?17 -> ?19 +11.76%

Concession Family Enclosure: ?15 -> ?17 +13.33%

Child Main Stand: ?22 -> ?24 +9.09%

Child North Stand: ?17 -> ?19 +11.76%

Child Family Enclosure: ?9 -> ?11 +22.22%

[roby]

Forget about bodies through the door or break even numbers or any of the rest of that guff, the simple math is that the prices for 'A' games have been bumped by way more than 5% needed to cover the Celtic and Rangers levy.

Adult Main Stand: ?27 -> ?29 +7.41%

Adult North Stand: ?22 -> ?24 +9.09%

Adult Family Enclosure: ?17 -> ?19 +11.76%

Concession Main Stand: ?22 ->

Concession North Stand: ?17 -> ?19 +11.76%

Concession Family Enclosure: ?15 -> ?17 +13.33%

Child Main Stand: ?22 -> ?24 +9.09%

Child North Stand: ?17 -> ?19 +11.76%

Child Family Enclosure: ?9 -> ?11 +22.22%

[/quot Exactly Scotty . Quite simply the club are once again using any excuse to fleece many of its loyal fans. For regular fans who sit in the main stand to be expected to pay 29 and 24 for a concession is nothing short of a disgrace. They did the same 2 seasons ago when we drew celtic in the cup . I boycotted that game in protest and wrote to the club expressing my anger. If i was not a season ticket holder i would be doing the same again and urging others to do likewise. You would think that a club whose support is dwindling year on year would at least try to look after what fans they have left.

[Alex MacLeod]

Firstly the prices were set before the OF levy was discussed. The majority of ICT fans are not affected by the increase as they are season ticket holders and ST prices stayed the same as last year. Those who are affected are the couple of hundred regular pay at the gater's like myself and the couple of thousand glory seekers and pretend ICT fans who only want to see the OF

[CaleyD]

I sent the club an E.Mail on 23rd July asking for confirmation of ticket prices for "A" Class games as the details did not appear on the official site and I was updating our website for the switch over.

The response I got read...

The ticket prices for Old Firm games are still under review in light of the proposals made by Rangers and Celtic.

As you can see, the ticket prices were set after the OF Levy was discussed.....and the clubs acceptance of the Levy is the only excuse they can realistically use. The OF ticket prices last year were ?2 more expensive than other matches, and this year they are ?4 more expensive.

[billyshears]

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, prices for OF game have to be more expensive than for other games. It's difficult to look at these things dispassionately, but try and see it like this. ICT are a business trying to sell a product (a football match) some of their products (OF matches) invariably sell around double the quantity of the majority. What are you going to do? The general public is effectively telling that the OF matches are more attractive, and therefore more valuable, than the other games. It is the board responsibility to charge more for the games with the greater demand.

Most of what we are seeing on this thread is individuals looking out for themselves (nothing wrong with that, by the way) people object to paying higher prices just because we are playing the OF. However, truly supporting our club involves concern for what happens off the pitch as well as the results on the pitch. To this end we should get behind the opportunity to increase revenue, I for one am all for getting as much as possible from those spectators who only come to the OF matches. It is unfortunate that the regular fans have to be hit with this as well (although there is a loyalty scheme which allows you to avoid these price hikes - it's called a season ticket - I know, I know, not everyone gets to enough games to justify it, but you get my point, I'm sure).

The flip side to all this, however, is that the club occaisionally have to drop prices for games that are less popular. They did so for the Gretna games last season, and I'm sure they will do something similar if the need arises later in the season. The overall thing to console ourselves with is that this so called "profiteering" over the OF tickets would only be that if an individual, or group of individuals were going to walk away at the end of the season with their pockets full of our cash. ICT is not going to be making anybody rich anytime soon!

[CaleyD]

Whilst I can see, and to a certain extent agree, with the principles of supply and demand and the fact that on the surface it makes sense to charge a premium for games where demand is higher, you also have to realise and accept that there's a breaking point beyond which you end up actually costing yourself money.

In the same way that decreasing ticket prices doesn't mean you'll get enough extra bodies through the gate to justify the discount, if you increase prices too much and the numbers drop off too far then your cutting your own throat.

I gave figures above to show just how narrow that margin is with regards to the price hike we are looking at for the OF matches.

We got a crowd of 7004 people through the gate for this fixture last year, and from that you we can already see that demand isn't outstripping supply.

If we assume that 3500 of those are Season Ticket Holders and maybe another 200 are comp tickets then your talking about 3300 paying customers (or there abouts). An extra ?2 of each of them nets you ?6600.

By the time we hand over ?3000+ to Celtic we're looking at ?3600 to ourselves, the equivalent to 150 adult tickets at ?24 each. So if the price increase discourages 151 adults then the increase has had a negative effect on the clubs income from the game. And that's without taking in to consideration losses from program sales, 50/50 sales, merchandise etc etc.

It would have been safer to have left prices as they were and employ a couple of temps for a week to handle the sale of Away tickets...they would have cost about ?600. Heck, I'd even volunteer my services for free for a week to keep our cash out of the hands of the OF.

As I said, I can see where your coming from, but it's not as if people are just mindlessly complaining about the prices, some of us have actually looked at it a little deeper and can see just how narrow the margin is between success and failure on this one. For a club like ICT every penny counts and whilst I appreciate that we have some very business minded people at the club, I do wonder whether they are "football" minded enough to understand just how much even a ?2 increase on a ticket can p*ss enough people off so as to prevent them from attending....not only this match, but perhaps other matches in the future also.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what kind of crowd we get at the game before we will know for certain if it's a thumbs up or down in terms of the "financial" success....but I know where I'd be placing my bet.

[RiG]

The majority of ICT fans are not affected by the increase as they are season ticket holders and ST prices stayed the same as last year.

Season ticket prices went up this year did they not?

[davieB]

The majority of ICT fans are not affected by the increase as they are season ticket holders and ST prices stayed the same as last year.

Season ticket prices went up this year did they not?

Mine certainly did!

[RiG]

Good! I thought I was imagining things

[Guzz]

Season tickets for the main stand went up by ?10 this year to ?340.

This averages ?17.90 per game, which is not too bad.

If you spread the cost I think you have to pay an extra 12 1/2 % which takes it to ?382.50 (?20 per game).

[roby]

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, prices for OF game have to be more expensive than for other games. It's difficult to look at these things dispassionately, but try and see it like this. ICT are a business trying to sell a product (a football match) some of their products (OF matches) invariably sell around double the quantity of the majority. What are you going to do? The general public is effectively telling that the OF matches are more attractive, and therefore more valuable, than the other games. It is the board responsibility to charge more for the games with the greater demand.

Most of what we are seeing on this thread is individuals looking out for themselves (nothing wrong with that, by the way) people object to paying higher prices just because we are playing the OF. However, truly supporting our club involves concern for what happens off the pitch as well as the results on the pitch. To this end we should get behind the opportunity to increase revenue, I for one am all for getting as much as possible from those spectators who only come to the OF matches. It is unfortunate that the regular fans have to be hit with this as well (although there is a loyalty scheme which allows you to avoid these price hikes - it's called a season ticket - I know, I know, not everyone gets to enough games to justify it, but you get my point, I'm sure).

The flip side to all this, however, is that the club occaisionally have to drop prices for games that are less popular. They did so for the Gretna games last season, and I'm sure they will do something similar if the need arises later in the season. The overall thing to console ourselves with is that this so called "profiteering" over the OF tickets would only be that if an individual, or group of individuals were going to walk away at the end of the season with their pockets full of our cash. ICT is not going to be making anybody rich anytime soon!

What a heap of rubbish . Killie are in the same position as us . They are playing Celtic this sunday and their prices are 25 pounds and 15 pounds for concessions. No matter which way you look at it they are ripping of our loyal and possible future fans . By the way in the champions league match between Chelsea and Bordeaux the prices were 25 for adults and 12 for concessions. Of course our facilities are streets ahead of stamford bridge !

[CaleyD]

Having had the chance to put my point to the club I am happy enough to concede that, whilst not ideal, the club are fully aware of the points I raised above and that such things were taken in to consideration when making the decision to increase ticket prices.

I might not agree with it, but I at least have a better understanding of the reasons behind it.

Hopefully, as the club and various fans groups move forward with plans to improve communication, decisions such as these will be better explained to us in the future and in doing so help remove some of the negative perceptions we have in regards to the reasons behind them.

[roby]

Having had the chance to put my point to the club I am happy enough to concede that, whilst not ideal, the club are fully aware of the points I raised above and that such things were taken in to consideration when making the decision to increase ticket prices.

I might not agree with it, but I at least have a better understanding of the reasons behind it.

Hopefully, as the club and various fans groups move forward with plans to improve communication, decisions such as these will be better explained to us in the future and in doing so help remove some of the negative perceptions we have in regards to the reasons behind them.

Did anyone see the photo in the Daily Record today at the Killie game . Celtic fans with banners showing their displeasure at the price charged . (25pounds). With the 2 stands which are normally full half empty , it is obvious fans have had enough. I wonder how the hell they would react to having to pay 29 to sit in our state of the art main stand. Our board should take notice of the empty seats at rugby park before deciding their prices in the future .

[Alex MacLeod]

Considering its ?28 for away fans at Parkhead they have a bit of a cheek

[RiG]

Considering its ?28 for away fans at Parkhead they have a bit of a cheek

And for a restricted view as well.

[roby]

Considering its ?28 for away fans at Parkhead they have a bit of a cheek

And for a restricted view as well.

Lets get one thing straight i am an i.c.t. fan not celtic. Unless you guys have not noticed we are playing in a half empty stadium practically every other home game. Unless we get our pricing right it will only get worse.

[RiG]

Lets get one thing straight i am an i.c.t. fan not celtic. Unless you guys have not noticed we are playing in a half empty stadium practically every other home game. Unless we get our pricing right it will only get worse.

No one said you were a Celtic fan