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pmacict

Dundee United fielded ineligible player

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Can i be the first to congratulate utd on a quite brilliant  substitution.

 

Will we actually get that 3 points now?

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I see neither of the players in question were in Utd's squad for tonight's game.

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6 minutes ago, Yngwie said:

I see neither of the players in question were in Utd's squad for tonight's game.

 

Capture d’écran (214).png

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If this is upheld then while we could benefit, it doesnt change the fact we didnt deserve 3 points or any points in that game, thankfully we may be saved the pain of having to go through replaying the tie. Clearly a bit of a blunder there from DUtd and you would think it would have been spotted within the club.

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6 hours ago, DalgetyBayJaggy said:

Will possibly turn out to be a £53k gift from Dundee FC courtesy of Dundee Utd!

That would just about pay for an extra player!

If we are awarded the points and that then results at the end of the season in another club or clubs dropping league places and losing prize money then the SPFL should oblige Dundee United to pay compensation to that club or clubs to that extent as a condition of being permitted to take up their place in the Championship next season.

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What are the precedents for punishments/remedies for fielding an ineligible player in a Scottish league match? Usually it happens in cup ties rather than league.

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In 2014, SPFL chiefs fined Peterhead £10,000 and ordered the replay of a League One game with Ayr United after Reece Donaldson was fielded while he should have been serving a ban.

However, in this case it is impractical to order a replay of Caley Thistle v United with four days left of the season.

- From The Express article above

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I guess Rangers would be the biggest precedent as they fielded ineligible players for years.

From here on in they should now be referred to as THE Dundee Utd and forced to start from the bottom of the league system.

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http://spfl.co.uk/docs/067_324__therulesofthespfl_1375800603.pdf 

Any Club Playing an ineligible Player in an Official Match and the Player concerned shall be in breach of the Rules and these Regulations. 21. If a Player Plays, whilst subject to suspension by the SFA and/or the League from participating or being named as a substitute in an Official Match, the Club and the Player concerned shall be in breach of the Rules and these Regulations.........................with the common statement throughout is that parties found guilty '... shall be liable to such penalty as the Board may decide. '

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14 minutes ago, CELTIC1CALEY3 said:

http://spfl.co.uk/docs/067_324__therulesofthespfl_1375800603.pdf 

Any Club Playing an ineligible Player in an Official Match and the Player concerned shall be in breach of the Rules and these Regulations. 21. If a Player Plays, whilst subject to suspension by the SFA and/or the League from participating or being named as a substitute in an Official Match, the Club and the Player concerned shall be in breach of the Rules and these Regulations.........................with the common statement throughout is that parties found guilty '... shall be liable to such penalty as the Board may decide. '

Typical SPFL - we don't have a rule as such, we'll just make it up as we go along.

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Call me a cynic, but we'll get noting out of this. SPFL have left plenty of wriggle room in those regulations to come up with a fudge: slad on the wrist for Dundee United and no recompense for us in terms of points. We should have won the game whether they had a couple of mediocre ineligible players in their squad or not. Free points would be welcome, but would not sit well with me...for a few hours at least!

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How right can you be

 

BBC Article http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36265268

Dundee United deducted three points and fined for fielding Ali Coote/Jamie Robson against . No replay or points given to ICT.

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So, SPFL rules,  the game didn't happen as there is no points won. 

In their rules SPFL say they are bound by UEFA rules and decisions;  The obvious precedent is Celtic v Legia Warsaw in 2014.
But as most expect, SPFL would rather find a big carpet and a big brush.
 

 
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30 minutes ago, tm4tj said:

How right can you be

 

BBC Article http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36265268

Dundee United deducted three points and fined for fielding Ali Coote/Jamie Robson against . No replay or points given to ICT.

Given that the number of points they get is now utterly irrelevant to Dundee United the points deduction is no penalty at all. Fudge and typical of the way Scottish football is administered.

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Crooked decision. They've ruled that the result is void, but we get no recompense for being cheated? It's almost like our club don't exist. Enough is enough. If there was ever a time for legal action this is it. 

Edited by AlexJones
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"The disciplinary hearing concluded that replaying the game before the end of the season - with the final round of games scheduled for this weekend - was not practical."

Not correct - they could have replayed the game the following midweek if they really wanted it. They have therefore made the decision that we should not have the opportunity to collect the 3 points although they clearly believed that was what should have been the solution. A quite bizarre decision.

 

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6 hours ago, Yngwie said:

What are the precedents for punishments/remedies for fielding an ineligible player in a Scottish league match? Usually it happens in cup ties rather than league.

Puzzling decision! As mentioned by HumbersideDude, this 'fixture' has netted a total of zero points.....
They (SPFL) have just made-it-up-as-they go along, here.
Furthermore, I don't see why it couldn't be replayed at the end of the campaign. Obviously, I'm clutching-at-straws here, as I don't think the 'infringement' impacted on the outcome of the original game.
To my knowledge, it is only the second time this has happened since the SPFLs formation. The Peterhead v Ayr United game was replayed when Peterhead fielded an ineligible player. In that instance, they (Peterhead) played a suspended player - there really is no excuse for that - a poor oversight, as the SFA produce a list of banned players every Thursday/Friday.

But this case was different, relating to players who'd been out on loan to lower league clubs. It seems that if a Premiership club lends players to lower division clubs, then they are considered to be away until the end of the season - unless they are re-registered back at their parent-club before the end of March.

So, for example, if we stuck Ali Sutherland on the bench tonight - that would probably not be allowed. Even if he didn't come on.
He's been on loan at Brora and has figured for them since March 31st, therefore he's deemed to be registered there until the end-of-the season (even though Brora's season's finished - ICT's has not).
A bit of a minefield - and a dangerous precedent set.

Ridiculous example here to show the farce - If we only needed a draw in a fixture, why not bring in Messi and Ronaldo. Neuer. Bale. (in theory).
Yeah, we'd win - but, would lose the 3 points for fielding ineligible players. Both teams would be awarded zero points - mission accomplished.

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Even within the football league it appears that cases like this are not fairly clear cut. There have been a number of different scenarios played out over the years down south with respect to the size of the fines, amount of suspended fines and docking of points. The one consistent item they appear to have is the games are not replayed.  

Therefore it appears that the SPFL have gone for the inconsistent approach which at least makes them consistent with their quasi-quango nature. 

Got to say the United fine of £30,000 does appear to be way over the top considering the offence. Is somebody at the SPFL possibly taking the opportunity to have one last twist of the knife with Stephen Thompson. 

Edited by Tichy_Blacks_Back

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There should be clear guidelines set out in the rules stating the punishments for such offences occuring and to leave it up to a board to decide is nonsense especially in this situation as they were clearly swayed by the timing. If it stated the financial penalty along with points loss or whether the fixture should be replayed or not in black and white then there would be no argument.

I don't agree that we should have got the points, regardless of who they fielded from their squad we are good enough to beat them and the performance wasn't good enough, I would have felt slightly embarrassed had we been given them.

The deduction of three points applied to this seasons total is laughable however and has absolutely no bearing on their final standing, they're down regardless so in my opinion is should have been applied to next season making them start on -3 points.

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The dates show the first leg of the play-off involving a Premiership team isn't until next Thurs, we already know its not ICT or DUtd therefore providing any rescheduled game was played by Wed then surely the season will have finished to allow for the play-offs given a completed league campaign?

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